Bored of waiting

[Murph7355]

... and besides the cost of anything and everything is on the rise.

As is the cost of the Taycan he might one day get to buy

...
It also looks like Lizzie will be freezing corp tax at 19%. Announcement next week.

That, of course, assumes she doesn't U-turn. Which I find highly unlikely.

She will be just like the rest of them. Realise there isn't a pot to piss in, and start plucking at the easy stuff.

CT U-turn.

Then luxury EV subsidies will be gone.

But it might help prices

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[Foxy]

I think they might be stuck with the EV subsidies, at some point they got to adopt a policy and stick with it. They backed off with solar a few years ago and look at the situation now, don’t want to drag politics into this forum but U.K. energy policy is in a mess.

I wonder if the Taycan market is softening in the U.K., I buy my cars through a mate who is an independent broker, he’s offered me two cancelled orders for delivery mid September, a 4S and a RWD, both loaded with options well over £30k. I’m chewing it over as I’ve a new RRS coming next month, but I’m tempted.

 

[whitex]

Ok I'll admit I'm being impatient for the Taycan, but having already waited 6 months starting to have buyers remorse creep in.

Interest rates on the rise will mean mortgage cost rising.

Not going to do anything right now, but do wonder if when I get the call to lock in the order I'll actually still wait it. Taycan GTS ST

It sounds a little like Porsche dragging their feet might have saved you some financial pain. Had you bought the car 6 months ago, the mortgage rates still would have gone up, inflation still would have raised your costs and possibly income, but now you'd have a monthly payment for a car you no longer feel comfortable paying (be it at a locked lower interest rate).

Personally I've been waiting over a year (14 months now?) for a CT Turbo allocation at multiple dealerships. One effect this had on me is to cool my initial enthusiasm, perhaps impart more patience - I am now a lot more willing to walk away from a negotiation. Until recently, maybe even today, I would have paid MSRP on the spot. However, by the time I actually get an allocation, I'm already thinking economy is tanking (people's stock portfolios values are shrinking), tax incentives are gone, price has gone up, people willing to spend $200K on a car will dry out in the next few months, so I expect to negotiate a discount. Ironically, this is almost the same situation I encountered around 2000 trying to buy a custom build 911. No allocations anywhere, then dot com crashed, and within a few months I was able to get one at a discounted price (even thought the initial contact with a dealer was "we have a cancellation, we would like to give you unique chance to pick it up at MSRP", I told them to pass it to the next person in line, they called back willing to negotiate a few days later). The only thing I missed out on is before the dot-com crash, some Bay Area dealers used to take stock options of pre-IPO companies (which I had plenty of back then) for up to 50% of the price of the car - it was a nice way to get some value out of the non-public stock from startups people in the valley were working in. Once dot-com crashed, they didn't want to even talk stock options at all. But that is not an issue today.

 

[Muu]

Yeah those of you who are self employed know that it's a complex equation, it's not as simple a "how much of my monthly wage do I want to sacrifice".

As you say, once the giddy enthusiasm goes you can be more objective. In the UK we can buy them via company pre tax, effectively cutting the cost in half. If that incentive went I'd be out.

Let's see what the future brings.

 

[kempez]

My enthusiasm has not wavered. In fact, it’s got worse I’m buying through my LTD, but I could easily also buy personally. The tax benefit is great and I’ve gone for pcp for the sole reason that I think we will see an advance in tech in 3-4 years time and I’ll almost certainly want another Porsche with the newer tech. It also means I can use the cash sitting in my company as a large buffer against any economy issues, as well as paying off the expensive bit of pcp straight away without incurring personal tax as the company owns the car. I don’t think I’ll be hugely affected by the economic outlook as I’m in a field that no one can do without and has massive skills shortages, but who knows.
In short: I am really looking forward to picking up the car…when it comes

 

[Car_fan]

I know this thread is getting a bit side tracked but just to give some of you guys a vision of the impending disaster in the winter I have a friend who has a busy retail grocery shop being quoted £100 a day energy costs from October so £3k just for electricity in 1 month.
A lot of small businesses are not going to survive without government help by the end of the year.

 

[Murph7355]

I think they might be stuck with the EV subsidies, at some point they got to adopt a policy and stick with it. They backed off with solar a few years ago and look at the situation now, don’t want to drag politics into this forum but U.K. energy policy is in a mess.

I wonder if the Taycan market is softening in the U.K., I buy my cars through a mate who is an independent broker, he’s offered me two cancelled orders for delivery mid September, a 4S and a RWD, both loaded with options well over £30k. I’m chewing it over as I’ve a new RRS coming next month, but I’m tempted.

They already "tuned" the immediate subsidies for non-company buyers.

It'll be a piece of piss to do the same with company taxes - scrap 100% write down and other benefits for any vehicle over an arbitrary amount (£50k? £60k?). I don't really see a downside in them doing it (from a political stand point).

How much are you being offered the 4S for?

I did notice one car on the approved site has now dropped a couple of k, making it broadly list price (10k miles, 1yr old).

Though if it's a cancelled order, presumably it's at list (so 110k-120k for the 4S?).

 

[Muu]

My enthusiasm has not wavered. In fact, it’s got worse I’m buying through my LTD, but I could easily also buy personally. The tax benefit is great and I’ve gone for pcp for the sole reason that I think we will see an advance in tech in 3-4 years time and I’ll almost certainly want another Porsche with the newer tech. It also means I can use the cash sitting in my company as a large buffer against any economy issues, as well as paying off the expensive bit of pcp straight away without incurring personal tax as the company owns the car. I don’t think I’ll be hugely affected by the economic outlook as I’m in a field that no one can do without and has massive skills shortages, but who knows.
In short: I am really looking forward to picking up the car…when it comes

Very good point, the financial agility in the business is very important.

Truss can do very little other than drop the VAT to 15% and keep the money flowing. Canceling the corp tax increase doesn't help the average "mondeo man" and if profits are down anyway the corp tax is negligible. At 25% corp tax I'd move to PAYE bonus, and simplify.

 

[Foxy]

They already "tuned" the immediate subsidies for non-company buyers.

It'll be a piece of piss to do the same with company taxes - scrap 100% write down and other benefits for any vehicle over an arbitrary amount (£50k? £60k?). I don't really see a downside in them doing it (from a political stand point).

How much are you being offered the 4S for?

I did notice one car on the approved site has now dropped a couple of k, making it broadly list price (10k miles, 1yr old).

Though if it's a cancelled order, presumably it's at list (so 110k-120k for the 4S?).

I think there’s every chance you are right on that, but all bets are off for me right now! The cars I’ve been offered are list but pretty high spec, as I’m just dipping into Taycan not sure what to makdd Ed of it.

 

[TaycanHero]

My enthusiasm has not wavered. In fact, it’s got worse I’m buying through my LTD, but I could easily also buy personally. The tax benefit is great and I’ve gone for pcp for the sole reason that I think we will see an advance in tech in 3-4 years time and I’ll almost certainly want another Porsche with the newer tech. It also means I can use the cash sitting in my company as a large buffer against any economy issues, as well as paying off the expensive bit of pcp straight away without incurring personal tax as the company owns the car. I don’t think I’ll be hugely affected by the economic outlook as I’m in a field that no one can do without and has massive skills shortages, but who knows.
In short: I am really looking forward to picking up the car…when it comes

I'm betting against you (!), and don't think anything big will happen until 2026 at the soonest, hence why I'm buying the car outright (through my business).

I will dump it after two years though, possibly for the Cayman EV.

 

[kempez]

I'm betting against you (!), and don't think anything big will happen until 2026 at the soonest, hence why I'm buying the car outright (through my business).

I will dump it after two years though, possibly for the Cayman EV.

Either way, I don’t think I’ll be in a bad position when I come to trade/upgrade. Sadly, I won’t be getting a 2 seater (yet), due to kids but maybe a new 911? Who knows.

 

[Archimedes]

If interest rates impact your decision on a car, you really can’t afford the car and you’re stretching. The cognitive dissonance you’re feeling is just your gut telling you that.

 

[TaycanHero]

Either way, I don’t think I’ll be in a bad position when I come to trade/upgrade. Sadly, I won’t be getting a 2 seater (yet), due to kids but maybe a new 911? Who knows.

Agree, I would say the biggest difference is just what you plan to do with the money when it comes to financing vs cash purchase.

With my surplus company money, the answer is not much, and I am betting that depreciation of my GTS ST will be lower than inflationary depreciation of fiat.

If I had kids, then the Cayman EV would not be an option. And were it not for tax, I would 100% be buying a 911 and not a Taycan.

Not that the Taycan isn't brilliant, it is. But I just have no need for five doors and five seats.

You absolutely should get a 911. Saw a few last week when I did my Silverstone PEC. Stunning vehicles and sound brilliant too.

 

[kempez]

Agree, I would say the biggest difference is just what you plan to do with the money when it comes to financing vs cash purchase.

With my surplus company money, the answer is not much, and I am betting that depreciation of my GTS ST will be lower than inflationary depreciation of fiat.

If I had kids, then the Cayman EV would not be an option. And were it not for tax, I would 100% be buying a 911 and not a Taycan.

Not that the Taycan isn't brilliant, it is. But I just have no need for five doors and five seats.

You absolutely should get a 911. Saw a few last week when I did my Silverstone PEC. Stunning vehicles and sound brilliant too.

I’m thinking of buying an investment property, funded via my company. Haven’t 100% decided yet but that’s my thought right now.

I am really tempted with a 911, but I should probably enjoy the Taycan first for a bit, once i

 

[TaycanHero]

I’m thinking of buying an investment property, funded via my company. Haven’t 100% decided yet but that’s my thought right now.

I am really tempted with a 911, but I should probably enjoy the Taycan first for a bit, once i

Great minds. I set up an SPV earlier this year, plus the bank account, email address, everything.

Literally all I need to do is fling a loan from my consulting business and away I go. However, it would be development and flipping. Renting it out seems a bad idea even as a ltd co. Plus there are punitive taxes for residential lettings.

@Archimedes mentioned that if interest rates affect someone's purchase decision, they probably can't afford it.

It's not that simple.

Interest rates increasing could crash property prices sharp and hard, before they rebound.

In that scenario, I might want to plough £500k into property that's discounted £200k, or I might be unable to do that as I've just spent £125k on the Porsche.

In that scenario, the Porsche can wait. I'll buy one discounted with my property profits in a few years.

p.s. another thing I have just done is chucked £50k into Premium Bonds effectively using company money. I gave myself a Directors Loan. It must be paid back within 9 months of year end. Stock market and crypto is too volatile. Property too illiquid. Premium bonds are tax free, guaranteed by government, instant access, and tax free winnings. So long as you invest £20k+, chances of winning are much higher. A no brainer if you have dead money sat there doing nothing. Just remember to pay back the loan in time. Leave it 30 days so you don't get caught 'bed n breakfasting' then rinse and repeat.

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