[North America] - this is getting embarrassing - Porsche nerfing/neutering the PMCC via OTA update?

[B61]

HOWEVER you must do this_ EACH_ time the unit starts up - if you forget to override the settings it will be set back to 20 amps - if your power off the unit or it goes to "sleep" on it's own (which it will do if it's idle)

If i change from 32A to 16A, settings are kept for next charging session.
So it’s definitely different software for US market.

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[daveo4EV]

If i change from 32A to 16A, settings are kept for next charging session.
So it’s definitely different software for US market.

this also used to be true prior to last night's OTA update - the PMCC would "remember" settings even after being unplugged…

my PMCC that was updated now reverts to 20 amps each time it powers up…I've tested by unplugging it - powering it on - setting to 40 amps - starting a charging session - confirm 40 amps being delivered - stop the charging session - unplug the PMCC _ plug it back in - and boom - 20 amps is the charge rate.

 

[daveo4EV]

overnight Porsche managed to take the most expensive, most incompatible, least reliable EVSE in the North American EVSE market and make it worse with one OTA update.

the PMCC is now effectively 20 amp 4.8 kW charger unless you fiddle with it each time it starts up.

 

[daveo4EV]

$349 - problem solved!

https://www.mustartpower.com/produc...rging-station-with-nema-14-50p-update-version

or $200 + TeslaTap

https://shop.tesla.com/product/corded-mobile-connector

both of these products are higher quality than the PMCC, won't overheat, will always work, and are way way way cheaper.

 

[DerekS]

Yeah, that process isn't good at all. But at least you CAN change it back. Maybe the Porsche engineers think it is the sockets and not the cable.

It's not the sockets (either the NEMA 14-50 or the sockets on the car.)

How do I know this? Because after changing ONLY the EVSE, I can reliably charge at 40 amps without erroring out. Same NEMA plug, same socket on the car.

The problem is Porsche's cabling on their EVSE is under spec, it gets too hot and the car's temp sensors at the socket shut it down.

 

[daveo4EV]

It's not the sockets (either the NEMA 14-50 or the sockets on the car.)

How do I know this? Because after changing ONLY the EVSE, I can reliably charge at 40 amps without erroring out. Same NEMA plug, same socket on the car.

The problem is Porsche's cabling on their EVSE is under spec, it gets too hot and the car's temp sensors at the socket shut it down.

+100 for this - sockets _CAN_ be the problem - but even when eliminating the socket as a core issue because there can be crappy no good terrible sockets - the PMCC still has issues.

a PMCC + bad-cheap-crappy socket is also a problem…so yeah - because of low quality sockets 20 amps is a more conservative choice - but the PMCC has problems even when the socket is not a contributing factor.

 

[Vercingetorix]

I’m betting when all is said and done Porsche just sends out new cables.

 

[daveo4EV]

I’m betting when all is said and done Porsche just sends out new cables.

cables are only part of any potential solution

the problem here is at least 3 distinct issues:

1. 10 gauge wire in the 50 amp supply cable is a "poor" choice given it's thermal characteristics under 40 amp loads
2. low quality cheap (and/or poorly installed) NEMA 14-50/6-50 plug sockets - a poor quality socket will aggravate thermal issues and EVSE reliability issues - but it's not the entire problem
   1. few if any electricians are going to install the $80 socket vs. the $12 socket unless the customer requests it…this is an endemic problem for the entire EVSE residential infrastructure.
3. the PMCC unit itself can thermally overheat under normal specified max load (40 amps 9.6 kW) in warmer climates - this issue is independent of #1 and #2
4. problems Porsche knows about but isn't saying anything…

changing the default to 20 amps - "solves" #1 and #3 - and mitigates issues caused by #2…but can not eliminate problems stemming from #2

improving the cable from #1 does nothing to address #2 - in some cases problem w/#2 make #1 worse¬
#3 requires a new unit design
#4 is known only internal to Porsche and they are not saying anything

so Porsche is between a rock/hard place here…

20 amps is a conservative choice given wide range of quality for home residential installs in North America - but is a terrible customer experience in that it doubles the charging time for the uninformed or checked out Taycan owner and to a lesser extent any Porsche Hybrid owners…

one could argue an overnight OTA update that doubles an owner's charging time duration with no notice to customers as to why, how, when to override it is a poor customer experience and will ultimately cause service center load when confused customers notice their vehicle is taking twice as long to charge as it used to and they bring it in for "warranty" service only to be told - it behaves correctly due to the OTA update - in the past when I was in industry myself and my co-workers would not have addressed the issue the way Porsche just demonstrably did - but everyone is entitled to conduct their business as they see fit…I believe it was a poor choice and poorly communicated and will confused most of their installed base and increase load on their poorly trained service centers - but what do I know?

One possible alternative would've been to do this via OTA update to the "vehicle" where you have a greater chance of interacting with the customer via in vehicle User Interface and Notifications in the "app" - rather than an OTA update to an EVSE that no one ever looks at and the key setting is buried in a settings panel no one knows about…

but apparently Porsche has no problem doing OTA updates to their entire North American EVSE fleet, but OTA updates to the vehicle fleet is still too iffy to be relied upon - LOL - now there's an insight for you…

Porsche just doubled the charge time for every Taycan owner in North America with an OTA update overnight, but you still need to bring your Taycan into a service shop to update it's software…who says VW has software problems...

this is not with out precedent however- the Chevy Bolt defaults to 8 amps vs. 12 amps when charging from 120 volts EVSE's - this is because most 120V residential circuits are of questionable quality and typically shared with other appliances so the Bolt puling 12 full amps is not a great home owner experience for a typical residential 120V garage circuit - few if any customers realized they can override this setting and increase their charging performance on these circuits by 50%

of the 3 problems - #2 is the worse cause it's external to the vehicle - can cause shorts/fires and is a real danger - I'm guessing this is more about the crappy socket problem than the overheating problem - because #2 is an actual safety issue…which is outside of Porsche's control.d

I'm wondering if Porsche has had some "melted" sockets, shorts of near fires - and this is their response to limit liability due to factors outside their control…

 

[daveo4EV]

Porsche just changed the default charge rate for every North America PMCC EVSE based Taycan owner to 4.8 kW…from 9.6 kW…

be happy - - I'm told it's no big deal that something that used to take 3 hours will now take 6 Hours with no notice or education and a terrible user experience to "fix" it and put it back to normal - nothing to see here - move on - Porsche is great.

 

[daveo4EV]

letter sent to my local service manager this morning…

[Service Manager Name],

As you may or may not know Porsche has a new version of PMCC software that was pushed OTA last night. Version 3014 (vs. Previous version 2934). This new software contains the updated reduction in charging amps with the EVSE now defaulting to 20 amps instead of the max rated 40 amps. This is unsurprising and given the known issues with the PMCC I sure this is the best Porsche can do under the circumstances to mitigate issues that I know about and issues that I do not know about.

However I feel there has been a loss here - in that, in solving this problem Porsche has overnight doubled the charge time for every Taycan owner in North America with no notice/education - and for Hybrid owners w/7.2 kW charger they have increase charging time by 60% - this is not an inconsequential change to charging durations for the entire fleet of Porsche Hybrids/EV’s.

I have successfully overridden the 20 amp default charge rate but apparently this setting is not saved and when the PMCC is idle (unplugged from vehicle or powered down via the power button) it reverts back to the 20 amp setting. To describe this as awkward and a terrible user experience is an understatement.

I’m sure Porsche has their reasons for this change and the data supports this type of decision based on what Porsche knows that I do not know. But I would like you to share with Porsche North America and Germany my disappointment regarding this sweeping change in charging time duration with no notice and/or limited education about what Porsche customers can do to restore optimal charging duration times. Not all customers are as well informed/educated as I am and I’m sure there will be some confusion and un-necessary warranty investigations when people notice their vehicles are taking 60% to 100% longer to charge than they did prior to this update.

Please express my disappointment to Porsche North America, but I look forward to any long term response that restores the fully documented and specified charging rate of 9.6 kW that was listed as the technical specifications of the vehicle and charger when it was purchased.

NOTE: it’s well understood the standard North American Taycan’s maximum charge rate is 48 amps (11-12 kW) which is the same as Europe and other regions. The Porsche USA website continues to this day to mis-represent the Taycan’s maximum L2 charge rate as 9.6 kW…which has now be reduced by default software setting in the PMCC to 4.8 kW

Thank you for your time and consideration in this matter - no response is required - this is simply feedback for Porsche corp. and an offer to engage with them should they want a customer perspective.

Take care and thank you!

 

[daveo4EV]

I also got the message "Smart charging not currently available".

So I called PCNA and asked if this was temporary. Response that this has been done across the board. Safety.

Version 3014 for now.

ummm follow up question Mr. Porsche (not the person posting above ) given Porsche's admission that their EVSE has safety issues running at a full 7.2 or 9.6 kW (32 and 40 amps respectively) what is Porsche's official recommendation for an EVSE vendor that can run safely at a full 7.2/9.6 kW? Matching my vehicle's documented technical specifications for maximum charge rate?

What EVSE do you now recommend to use instead of the Porsche one?

if Porsche is admitting their EVSE isn't safe to use at a full 40 amps (and given their OTA update that's a pretty definitive statement they think their EVSE is unsafe at 40 amps) - they sold me a car that can charge at 9.6 kW - what EVSE do they recommend?

 

[Deleted member 7736]

$349 - problem solved!

https://www.mustartpower.com/produc...rging-station-with-nema-14-50p-update-version

or $200 + TeslaTap

https://shop.tesla.com/product/corded-mobile-connector

both of these products are higher quality than the PMCC, won't overheat, will always work, and are way way way cheaper.

Dave, I agree with you that this firmware update is a poor solution to a poorly designed charger. But I gotta ask... if the solution literally costs $349, is this really worth the 7 hours you've spent railing non-stop in this thread? Take a deep breath man. It's a nice sunny day in Santa Cruz.

 

[daveo4EV]

It's a nice sunny day in Santa Cruz.

actually it's not - LOL - kinda of an overcast day

but I'm just trying to sort facts here - Porsche pushed a big update - they nerf'd the fleet overnight…and dead silence from them on what owners should do if charging time matters to them.

if Tesla had done this via an OTA you all would be screaming bloody murder and how bad they are for doing something like this to their customers to cover up their crappy product.

 

[dickp]

I sold my PMCC EVSE and am using the Mustart. Never have had any issues with the Mustart. When I scheduled the Taycan for the software update the Service Manager told me I had to bring the PMCC in so they could update it also. Advised them I no longer had it.
Glad I got rid of the PMCC.

 

[Windpower]

Looks like Tesla has a similar issue with their mobile charger. You can’t run them at full rated amperage:


Mobile Connector Rated Circuit Amperage / Maximum Charging Amperage:

50 / 32 (Limited to less than 80% of 50A rating for extra margin of safety from possible overheating)

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