UK Government considering new tax on EV drivers in Budget (According to BBC and Telegraph)

[AlisdairH]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c0mxgzpj1dvo

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[D00notD00d]

According to The Telegraph .. …
Pre Budget crazy season.

 

[Fish Fingers]

I've always felt like I was on borrowed time with cheap home charging.

But what about people who are charging in the wild and paying VAT, where cost is already similar or more expensive than fuel.
Surely this need addressing at the same time?

If its more expensive to own an EV, people wont buy them.

But they wont have thought it through. As usual, they will legislate and then be surprised by the consequences.

 

[Bennachie]

As if owners are going to be 'honest' about their mileage declaration.............. what a stupid idea. Typical Reeves thinking

 

[n3ophyte]

I’m curious how annual EV mileage will be monitored. During annual MOT will obviously not capture cars <3years old.

 

[Dave Birch]

The Times reckons 3p per mile is being considered

 

[prj]

Don't worry you can get an Odometer freeze gadget on the Taycan which stops the mileage from going up. Takes 10 minutes to fit or remove it also.

So unless they fit GPS on all the cars... then I think those gadgets are about to get a lot more popular.

 

[n3ophyte]

Don't worry you can get an Odometer freeze gadget on the Taycan which stops the mileage from going up. Takes 10 minutes to fit or remove it also.

So unless they fit GPS on all the cars... then I think those gadgets are about to get a lot more popular.

So there is

At £200 each I sense a group buy (15% off) coming

 

[prj]

So there is

At £200 each I sense a group buy (15% off) coming

Pays for itself after 6k miles or so.

 

[BigBob]

Don't worry you can get an Odometer freeze gadget on the Taycan which stops the mileage from going up. Takes 10 minutes to fit or remove it also.

So unless they fit GPS on all the cars... then I think those gadgets are about to get a lot more popular.

All well and good until you sell the car and expose yourself to a prison sentence for mileage fraud. I think i'll pay the 3p a mile charge!

 

[Fish Fingers]

All well and good until you sell the car and expose yourself to a prison sentence for mileage fraud. I think i'll pay the 3p a mile charge!

Most on here will pay, but all the other schemers and dodgers wont.
Just like they don't have insurance and MOT etc.

So it will be the usual case of Honest Joe paying, Dodgy Joe evading....... and getting no punishment when caught as they have ADHD and there Grandad died 14 years ago, which upset them. Same as for all the other 57 convictions when they were given a last chance.🫤

 

[prj]

All well and good until you sell the car and expose yourself to a prison sentence for mileage fraud. I think i'll pay the 3p a mile charge!

The way the odometer freeze works on the Taycan is it blocks the global counter, so all the modules have the same frozen mileage. Even the dealer can't tell, and the mileage doesn't jump back even if you remove the device (just starts counting normally).

I'm not suggesting you should do it, but unless you run your mouth nobody will ever find out.

 

[BigBob]

The way the odometer freeze works on the Taycan is it blocks the global counter, so all the modules have the same frozen mileage. Even the dealer can't tell, and the mileage doesn't jump back even if you remove the device (just starts counting normally).

I'm not suggesting you should do it, but unless you run your mouth nobody will ever find out.

It might be the perfect crime, but it's still a crime.....

You clearly know your IT stuff. If the gov't(s) do come up with this sort of road pricing, there may well be some mileage (pun intended) in developing software that can detect whether a car has been clocked like this for future buyers to use.

 

[prj]

It might be the perfect crime, but it's still a crime.....

You clearly know your IT stuff. If the gov't(s) do come up with this sort of road pricing, there may well be some mileage (pun intended) in developing software that can detect whether a car has been clocked like this for future buyers to use.

I am not disputing it's a crime.

You can't develop any software because the mileage gets intercepted before it goes out to any modules.
About the only thing you can check is the hour counter in some controllers and compare it with the miles travelled and if the ratio of hours to miles is very high, then it's suspect. You still wouldn't be able to prove anything - maybe the owner likes to sit in the car with the ignition on a lot and listen to the stereo.

Also, this is highly vendor specific. It's not feasible to develop anything at all.
If it gets widespread then the solution will be that every EV will have to be fitted with a GPS tracker and being caught driving without one will result in automatic fines.

These "filter" devices are also clever in that you can make it only count a percentage of the mileage. Of course they don't exist for all cars and they don't work as perfectly as on the Taycan on the majority of the cars, because the architecture is different.

 

[pjg03d]

Here in Georgia (US) we pay a higher fee annually to register EVs in lieu of paying no gas taxes since we don't buy gasoline. Many states do this.

EVs have a significantly lower social cost, even if road usage causes a higher rate of deterioration due to the heavier weight. EV users simply should not be paying more in taxes to drive EVs; gas users that do not switch to EVs should be paying increasingly more as EV adoption increases - both to encourage EV adoption, and as a reflection of the social cost of carbon output over time.

I did some napkin math a while ago, I'll try to convert it to UK/metric measurements for the sake of consistency with the thread:

GA gas tax is £ .07/liter. At 8.5km/L, 19.3k km a year, that's about £148, and 2271 liters of gas (petrol?) burned at about 5.28 kilos of CO2 generated per liter - 5443 kilos CO2 added to the atmosphere annually.

EV fee with annual registration is £161. GA electrical generation mix is about 115g CO2 produced per kWh. At 4 km per kWh, 19312 km (per year) is about 4800 kWh, or 552 kilos of carbon annually NOT being put into the atmosphere by me (and everyone else who does) driving an EV.

So my fee for avoiding adding 552 kilos of carbon to the atmosphere (assuming the power for my EV was generated only from GA Power) is £ 13.

A broad figure of the SCC/social cost of carbon is £ 145/ton. So driving an EV powered by the GA Power grid mix is saving all of us about £ 782 a year vs an ICE vehicle. And I am paying £13 for the luxury of saving all of us some money.

This is a great reminder that politicians and their staff are often not trained in social sciences or policy creation, public policy in general, and certainly not the fast-evolving consumer technology they are asked to regulate. EV owners simply should not be paying more taxes to drive EVs.

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