Hate for electrics saddens me.

[riburn3]

I honestly can't go back to ICE, no matter how much I love some of Porsche's ICE products (especially my old Targa 4S).

This right here is a quote of experience. A lot of folks against EVs have never tried them. It's like your kid that refuses to try to eat something because "they don't like it", but have never tasted it. Eventually they try it and realize they had been missing out the whole time.

I have kept a string of ICE and EV vehicles in my garage over the last decade, and always find myself going back to EV's for the reasons you referenced. There is something about an engine making noise as you shift gears, but honestly, not enough for me there to override the overall top to bottom conveniences of owning an EV.

Folks can poop on EV's all they want, the reality is car manufacturers have seen the writing on the wall and it's just a matter of time.

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[mjw930]

Yes, most of those are hyperbole, most reasonably intelligent adults don't believe the fodder in the list.

However, Winter Range, Charging infrastructure, Electrical grid capability, weight (specifically when referring the "Sports Cars") and inability to tow are all major shortcomings that could make an EV a non starter for a lot of people.

 

[Fish Fingers]

I think its mostly people's jealousy over the cost. They can't afford one, so they look for any negatives they can.

A lot of people I know who are anti EV would be over the moon if a brand new EV suddenly appeared in their drive foc.
Suddenly all the 'reasons' they dislike EVs wouid dissappear.

My favourite responses for the usual anti ev ramblings are, when they finish ranting and eventually ask a question like 'how long does it go on a charge?'. I say 'you tell me, you seem to be the expert on them'

If they start going on about lithium being mined by kids etc, I say 'if only everybody was as conscientious as you.....refusing to own mobile phones or anything else with lithium batteries'.

Final one was from someone on here; 'EVs aren't for everyone......they are quite complex and advanced' ?

 

[optik382]

Well, for now, some things are true: EVs are heavier, so there's more tire pollution and it takes more tech to make them fun to drive. They in fact do not make great track cars yet, even a Taycan. And they do in fact suck for road trips, because charging infrastructure is poor in most places, and 20-30 minutes *is* a long time! This is coming from a guy who owns three EVs. But I don't do road trips often, I am willing to accept poor track performance, and the overall tradeoffs are good for everyday use.

The infuriating thing is when people have these comments like EVs are "coal powered" or "cause more pollution overall." There are very legit studies that show a crossover point at relatively low miles where EVs have lower total energy use.

I got to drive my coworker's MacLaren 750s the other day. Out on the street, for daily use... it's slow. Even the owner agreed, his Model 3 (not even 3P) feels faster in most everyday circumstances. I, for one, will never go back.

I am super curious to try cars like the Ionic 5N that attempt to make EV driving as engaging as ICE driving, even at the expense of performance.

 

[snstevens]

Yes, most of those are hyperbole, most reasonably intelligent adults don't believe the fodder in the list.

However, Winter Range, Charging infrastructure, Electrical grid capability, weight (specifically when referring the "Sports Cars") and inability to tow are all major shortcomings that could make an EV a non starter for a lot of people.

I respectfully disagree.

• Winter issues of all sorts affect cars (think electric engine warmers in Minnesota when you go to work, or diesels that never shut down at truck stops because they might not restart).
• Charging infrastructure is only an issue for high speed charging since the grid is capable of handling a fully EV world in the US (see this post and embedded video).
  • Since we are not 100% EV yet, eventually the HS charging infrastructure will be there. Recent announcements (partnerships with Tesla and this article) make it clear to me that it is only a matter of time.
  • A vast majority of the charging is at home and that is going very well. Just filled my wife's Lexus RX 450h (hybrid) yesterday and she's paying $0.15/mile to get around, I'm paying $0.045/mile, over 3 times less.
• Not sure why you raised towing as an issue. The new SUVs and truck EVs coming out can all tow so ???

I do agree that weight is a potential issue for our roads, and it will get worse over time if we don't improve battery technology. I do see a day though where we get 350-400 miles of range in a car that weighs closer to 3,500 pounds.

@DerekS - I'm sorry you have to put up with this shit from fellow Porsche enthusiasts. This is a somewhat regional phenomenon though, but even in the Pacific NW we have old-timers who simply love their ICE cars and dread the future.

When I talk with them I try to share their enthusiasm for their cars, and also share mine for the Taycan. I even meet up with them and we go on test drives (usually we are both in the same car so the owner can describe its qualities). At the end of the day, I get lots of positive comments about the Taycan design and performance, and it starts to change minds.

 

[npx]

I've had very few hater experiences in the Taycan. Even my friends who are hardcore tuners enjoyed it and were very excited to try it. Most say they like having noise and frankly for an enthusiast car I could not agree more. For a daily (which the taycan is 85 percent of the time, driven normally) I don't miss it much. The absolutely brutal acceleration is what sells most, and the very fast response. When people express dismay about the relatively unimpressive range, it's usually counterbalanced by admitting that the great driving experience pays for it.

If you're gonna get 220-250 miles on one charge driving as you would without care for charging (like an ICE), at least you can get melted into your seat

 

[optik382]

I agree that "with time" it'll get better, but right now you can't really have a real track day with a Taycan. I have the Turbo, it's fast at first, then I lose my AC, then it gets slower, and there's no practical way to charge it at almost any track. And on the track, you *do* feel the weight. You just can't do a real day, with 30m heats and 30m breaks in between. I can do it in my $25k Subaru though, with $2k worth of brake upgrades, it'll go hard all day long. We can always say that "with time" the issues will be resolved, but that's not what this is about. It's about now.

 

[optik382]

Like I said in my original post, "I am willing to accept poor track performance, and the overall tradeoffs are good for everyday use." The same argument applies to road trips.

But when it comes to this debate that people have, I think it does make sense to acknowledge the downsides when they are real. You, like many others, just argued that EVs are good on the track, and can "hold their own." But that's just not true, at least not today. It's just another example that BOTH SIDES are willing to spout factually incorrect nonsense in the defense of their "car religion."

 

[Redhot2474]

Why not having both?

I have a Taycan GTS , I’m thinking next year for my 50th adding a Targa GTS , it’s the only ice car I’d ever consider

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