New Battery monitoring software update?

[D00notD00d]

Different battery chemistry / type in J1.2.

Do any of us know enough to know that precludes the problem/reduces the risk?
I don’t know if all of the LG batteries in all of the manufacturers which LG supply use a common chemistry, I suspect not. LG are one of Tesla’s suppliers, I’ve not heard of any Tesla/LG recalls, US members may know more.

All of this speculation is down to Porsche AG’s poor comms strategy and apparently nonchalant approach to product safety and customer retention.

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[D00notD00d]

@chun - have you seen anything which says the Porsche problem is definitely the same one as the ipace - the folded tab.

 

[Chalper]

Yes, we know that to be 100% true. By law proceedings.
It is the exact same modules, same cells, same chemistry, all manufactured in Poland. Different enclosure.

I think all of us would be interested in reading the legal documents. Can you please provide your source? Nobody else seems to have found that information. Greatly appreciated.

 

[chun]

@chun - have you seen anything which says the Porsche problem is definitely the same one as the ipace - the folded tab.

Yes, the recalls on the European page have it spelled out: https://ec.europa.eu/safety-gate-alerts/screen/webReport/alertDetail/10092672?lang=en

There are several realls for different EU members all using similar or identical language

 

[chun]

I think all of us would be interested in reading the legal documents. Can you please provide your source? Nobody else seems to have found that information. Greatly appreciated.

• Taycan: Uses 396 cells organized into 33 modules (12 cells per module).
• I‑Pace: Uses 432 cells arranged in 36 modules (12 cells per module).
• Both use LG Chem E66a NMC 712 cells manufactured by LG poland.

What makes you think LG would design different cell formats with identical chemistry and identical capabilities, to be used in different identical layout modules? But even if you do believe they do that, you can check on LG chem's website that they had at the time only manufactured these batteries.

That is not to say that the cars are identical, just that the battery modules are. Taycan uses a 800V architecture, with their own motors and inverter. While Jaguar is on a 400v architecture, with different motors and inventer. They also have vastly different battery cooling setups, taycan having a dedicated heat pump

 

[Travis]

No I am not sucking off a corporation, not sure how someone could do that, yes I have a Taycan, yes I do expect it to depreciate like every electric car, if you spent $250k on a Taycan and expected anything else but depreciation that’s on you, not Porsche. It’s normal to keep an eye on issue, have some concern, but to be so dramatic and fearful like your driving a bomb, when as far as anyone knows, there are zero CONFIRMED battery fires, zero reported injuries, you make it like Porsche has a gun to your family’s head. Sell the car there is a free market, all your bitching and entitlement is embarrassing. If in fact Taycan start burning to the ground due to battery fires, and if then Porsche does nothing, ok complain. They have issued a recall, are working on a solution that has not even been announced yet, give it a chance before you plug like a baby to even see how things play out. So much bitching about something that has not even happened yet, pathetic. If your this worked up about your car, can’t imagine how actual problems in life are managed.

 

[chun]

No I am not sucking off a corporation, not sure how someone could do that, yes I have a Taycan, yes I do expect it to depreciate like every electric car, if you spent $250k on a Taycan and expected anything else but depreciation that’s on you, not Porsche. It’s normal to keep an eye on issue, have some concern, but to be so dramatic and fearful like your driving a bomb, when as far as anyone knows, there are zero CONFIRMED battery fires, zero reported injuries, you make it like Porsche has a gun to your family’s head. Sell the car there is a free market, all your bitching and entitlement is embarrassing. If in fact Taycan start burning to the ground due to battery fires, and if then Porsche does nothing, ok complain. They have issued a recall, are working on a solution that has not even been announced yet, give it a chance before you plug like a baby to even see how things play out. So much bitching about something that has not even happened yet, pathetic. If your this worked up about your car, can’t imagine how actual problems in life are managed.

Huh? where exactly have i done what are you accusing me of? You are the one emberssing yourself, not me.

Maybe try to read before answering people. I am preatty sure I have provided factual info, based on avaliable info on the battery used in the car, and based on communication from porsche dealership regarding the software that was supposed to come.

Yes, they have issued a recall, they delayed the solution. The solution is just a software that disabled the module, likely, based on the 0 communication given by porsche, as it has been with other manufacturers that go though the same issues involving the same battery. And since it is the same battery, from LG chem, it is very normal to compare how other manufacturers of EVs "solved" the issues.

Are we supposed to not look across the fence, only at Porsche? Get real... You sound like a 9 year old iphone fanboy. Not to mention that you can't make an argument without name calling and insults.

Make a proper argument instead of insults. Why should people not compare how other manufacturers dealt with the same issues on the same batteries? Why should people not be worried or concerned? Why should people not speculate on this topic? Why should people not be concerned that the "solution" to a hardware problem, a diagnosis software with a remote shut-off switch, was delayed with 0 communication?

 

[GTSS]

The solution has been announced to be out by the end of Q1/2025. This obviously did not happen. We are still under 80% charge limit and every 60-day periodic checkup.

 

[W1NGE]

The solution has been announced to be out by the end of Q1/2025. This obviously did not happen. We are still under 80% charge limit and every 60-day periodic checkup.

I'm not - I had my 2 yr service last week, WRS0 and 1 applied - pertaining to BMS monitoring and battery check and have it documented by letter and sales invoice.

This is truly a buggers muddle!

I'm off to grab a 992.2 whilst there's still value in my J1.1 and wait for the dust to settle!

 

[chun]

I'm not - I had my 2 yr service last week, WRS0 and 1 applied - pertaining to BMS monitoring and battery check and have it documented by letter and sales invoice.

This is truly a buggers muddle!

I'm off to grab a 992.2 whilst there's still value in my J1.1 and wait for the dust to settle!

You are the only one that reported this so far, while Porsche's official report is completely different: official delayed to Q2 and dealers don't have access to anything. In fact many dealers are even refusing to do the 60 days check, due to lack of resources.

So I am also not following those restrictions, not because I have the solution, like you may or may not have, but because the dealer doesn't have resources to care about my car...

My bet is your dealer did a mistake and installed you something unrelated, or a demo software like Tooney mentioned. Either way, it won't make much difference realistically, since hopefully your battery won't crap its pants anyway

 

[Vim Schrotnock]

Yes, we know that to be 100% true. By law proceedings.
It is the exact same modules, same cells, same chemistry, all manufactured in Poland. Different enclosure.
None of the recalls are about the enclosure, for porsche or for any of the other brands affected.

The recalls have to do with a manufacturing issue, resulting in folded anode tabs in the cells. Sadly, if 1 cell in a module is affected, the whole module needs to be replaced. There are 33 modules, each with hundreds of cells. The likelihood of a cell among hundreds of cells to be defective is high, hence any of the 33 modules can be affected.





The terms of the agreement with Porsche haven't been made public as far as I could find

The software from Porsche, same as Jaguar, plans to identify the module in which a cell is defective and disable the module/s, resulting in range reduction; until it is replaced at Porsche. Same as the software deployed by Jaguar. But Jaguar found out that they would realistically be replacing 90%+ of the modules, hence they just bought back the cars.
New modules, used in Taycan j1.2 supposedly don't have this manufacturing issue.

Your count of cells/module is incorrect - I believe you meant to say there are hundreds of cells in the battery, but only 12 cells/module.

The two-tier Performance Battery Plus used in the Taycan Turbo S and Taycan Turbo contains 33 cell modules consisting of 12 individual cells each (396 in total). The total capacity is 93.4 kWh. The cells themselves are so-called pouch cells.

 

[chun]

Your count of cells/module is incorrect - I believe you meant to say there are hundreds of cells in the battery, but only 12 cells/module.

The two-tier Performance Battery Plus used in the Taycan Turbo S and Taycan Turbo contains 33 cell modules consisting of 12 individual cells each (396 in total). The total capacity is 93.4 kWh. The cells themselves are so-called pouch cells.

Yes, sorry. I clarified in another post a bit higher when comparing with the Jaguar the batteries themselves

 

[Chalper]

• Taycan: Uses 396 cells organized into 33 modules (12 cells per module).
• I‑Pace: Uses 432 cells arranged in 36 modules (12 cells per module).
• Both use LG Chem E66a NMC 712 cells manufactured by LG poland.

What makes you think LG would design different cell formats with identical chemistry and identical capabilities, to be used in different identical layout modules? But even if you do believe they do that, you can check on LG chem's website that they had at the time only manufactured these batteries.

Thanks for the additional detail - from what I've read, the buy-back iPaces used LG Chem's LGX N2.1 pouch cells with NMC 622 chemistry (and the Taycan uses the E66a with NMC712 as you mentioned). You are, of course, right that regardless of the differences, the same defects could easily span both sets of cells. What a mess...

 

[W1NGE]

You are the only one that reported this so far, while Porsche's official report is completely different: official delayed to Q2 and dealers don't have access to anything. In fact many dealers are even refusing to do the 60 days check, due to lack of resources.

So I am also not following those restrictions, not because I have the solution, like you may or may not have, but because the dealer doesn't have resources to care about my car...

My bet is your dealer did a mistake and installed you something unrelated, or a demo software like Tooney mentioned. Either way, it won't make much difference realistically, since hopefully your battery won't crap its pants anyway

I firmly believe my dealership did as per the hard copy and verbal evidence post works.

Either way I don't lose sleep over it like most people getting tied in knots on this subject (I don't want to appear to be dismissive but I think the issue has artificially grown arms and legs).

I think @f1eng has had the same work and note but different verbal statement.

 

[eddieterry]

I firmly believe my dealership did as per the hard copy and verbal evidence post works.

Either way I don't lose sleep over it like most people getting tied in knots on this subject (I don't want to appear to be dismissive but I think the issue has artificially grown arms and legs).

I think @f1eng has had the same work and note but different verbal statement.

I had the same work and note but a verbal statement that was at odds with yours - just wish Porsche would get its communication with customers on a better footin.

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