2025 RWD vs 2022 RWD Impressions (Long and Nerdy)

[Avantgarde]

Not impossible but I doubt it, personally. Electric motors do have a wide and smooth power curve though and it isn't "fixed" like in an IC engine, it depends on acceptable temperature so is time as well as rpm linked.

Vehicle stability control can be very much more precisely controlled and much faster acting with an electric motor than it ever could be with a piston engine and with the exception of the conditions you mentioned probably acts entirely transparently to the driver.

Try switching it off and measure it again.

Not impossible but I doubt it, personally. Electric motors do have a wide and smooth power curve though and it isn't "fixed" like in an IC engine, it depends on acceptable temperature so is time as well as rpm linked.

Vehicle stability control can be very much more precisely controlled and much faster acting with an electric motor than it ever could be with a piston engine and with the exception of the conditions you mentioned probably acts entirely transparently to the driver.

Try switching it off and measure it again.

The difference in torque peak between with and without LC is interesting, the initial wiggles are probably vehicle stability control interventions and the ramp down probably to match thrust force at the gear shift point to reduce shock load in transmission and jerkiness in the cockpit.

The problem with using torque as a measure is that without knowing the gear ratio you don't know the tyre forces.

I don't know about now but at the Ferrari F1 team back when my mate was chief engineer they, as all teams do, got a total overload of applicants for engineering places and those that got as far as the interview were ususally very well qualified but they still were rejected if they got the wrong answer to the first question "what is more important power or torque?"

The difference in torque peak between with and without LC is interesting, the initial wiggles are probably vehicle stability control interventions and the ramp down probably to match thrust force at the gear shift point to reduce shock load in transmission and jerkiness in the cockpit.

The problem with using torque as a measure is that without knowing the gear ratio you don't know the tyre forces.

I don't know about now but at the Ferrari F1 team back when my mate was chief engineer they, as all teams do, got a total overload of applicants for engineering places and those that got as far as the interview were ususally very well qualified but they still were rejected if they got the wrong answer to the first question "what is more important power or torque?"

I have the car till Wednesday, will try it out with TC turned off tomorrow and we shall see. I am not ruling your theory out.

One thing to keep in mind with Gen2 is all rear motors are the now the same physical unit across the range. So RWD’s max torque and power has to be artificially limited and not necessarily a function of usual electric motor hardware limits.

Also respectfully I know the difference between Power and Torque i might have misspoken by saying “limiting the power” above, i have been talking about the torque the entire time.

I do think the linear drop in torque curve after 45 mph in first gear is just car keeping the power constant at max HP (otherwise the MAX HP would be breached given you are above 10K rpm at the point). (Attaching a video of the LC run)

Btw Gear ratios are known for taycan (believe its around 16:1 for first gear). Website also has the max wheel torque for each model.

Anyways i will test your theory and report back. I will take a video so we can see.

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[f1eng]

I have the car till Wednesday, will try it out with TC turned off tomorrow and we shall see. I am not ruling your theory out.

My old sports car has 380 bhp and no traction control. It can't take full throttle in 1st gear without spinning the Pirelli Pzeros uncontrollably and you have to be careful in 2nd.
I would be shocked if a Taycan doesn't use stability control on full throttle acceleration from a standstill, there are several levels of stability control as well as off, I believe, depending on settings.
I leave mine in the default all the time.
In nearly 50 years of working on performance cars I don't think I have ever come across one which doesn't need driver controlled or electronically controlled wheel slip control.

Be careful with stability control completely off...

 

[Avantgarde]

My old sports car has 380 bhp and no traction control. It can't take full throttle in 1st gear without spinning the Pirelli Pzeros uncontrollably and you have to be careful in 2nd.
I would be shocked if a Taycan doesn't use stability control on full throttle acceleration from a standstill, there are several levels of stability control as well as off, I believe, depending on settings.
I leave mine in the default all the time.
In nearly 50 years of working on performance cars I don't think I have ever come across one which doesn't need driver controlled or electronically controlled wheel slip control.

Be careful with stability control completely off...

Good advice ? i will try to find an empty parking lot or something.

 

[d00d]

Thanks for the review, my J1.1 RWD upshifts at 80 MPH if it's in Sport Plus, otherwise it's 60 MPH.

 

[MissionE]

I had a 2025 RWD as a loaner while my car is in for service. Had the full weekend to test it out. The differences are bigger than I thought so thought I'd share some impressions.

The powerband is definitely improved, although I still think they should introduce an S/RWD model. Next gen mules should be hitting the streets by end of year.

 

[Avantgarde]

Ok reporting back on this. I re-did the tests with Traction Control completely turned-off (not just “limited”) and it does not make any difference on dry surface except maybe for first couple meters of a 0-60 run, where you get very brief wheel spin. Bottom line: torque curve is clearly manipulated in first gear so you can’t get wheel spin with a RWD on dry roads even if you wanted. I am attaching a video (FYI i was not putting oncoming traffic at risk here, as i tried it first in a safe environment to see that the car is barely spinning wheels).

This proves a long speculated point that RWD Taycan is artificially reigned in low speeds. Something many of us felt but never had a proof.

Without the manipulation the torque curve should like this:

But it rather looks like this:

And this is with LC. Without LC the depression of First gear torque curve is even more pronounced. Now I am pretty sure Gen1 is subject to a very similar manuplation in first gear, based on how it feels. Which means, unless you live in Germany and enjoy high speed Autobahns everyday you are not even utilizing the lower non-LC performance in your day to day driving.

I got back my car today and it felt slow after Gen2. Knowing that it didn't have to be, pisses me off. I thought I bought a 476hp/357nm car, then I learned that only 380hp/340nm of that is available in day to day driving, and now I realize even that lower power level is manuplated so you only get a fraction of that at lower speeds.

It is lame what Porsche did here. RWD means one less motor, one less inverter for them. Significant cost benefit. Why screw it on purpose like this? Don't understand.

 

[gtm]

@Avantgarde - Check out Redshift Performance. Replacement control unit that gives you full power all the time. Supposedly no throttling of what the battery, inverter and motor can do.

 

[freeforall]

During day to day driving you spend most of your time in 2nd gear

@Avantgarde does your car really drive in 2nd gear at low speed when in Normal mode? I have a MY23 and it is always in 1st gear up to 80km/h unless I put it in range mode which I never do in the city because it lowers the car.
I always thought that this behavior is specific to RWD because my understanding is that 4S and above would drive in 2nd gear in normal mode if you don’t hit the accelerator like crazy. But now you are making le doubt and wondering whether my car has a problem.

 

[Gru]

@Avantgarde does your car really drive in 2nd gear at low speed when in Normal mode? I have a MY23 and it is always in 1st gear up to 80km/h unless I put it in range mode which I never do in the city because it lowers the car.

2nd gear at low speed is only under Range mode, 1st gear in all other modes (Normal, Sport and Sport +)

 

[freeforall]

2nd gear at low speed is only under Range mode, 1st gear in all other modes (Normal, Sport and Sport +)

Thanks, that’s aligned with what I have as well.

 

[Avantgarde]

This is well documented before. In normal mode at most speeds the car drives in 2nd gear and downshifts (which is very noticable) depending on the speed and pedal position. And it is not that easy to trigger a downshift (requires close to half-pedal travel in most speeds). The only mode where the car automatically picks the first gear without any torque request is sport mode (gear change is audibly noticable when sport mode is selected at low speed). Explained in detail in Porsche's technical overview (see below).

 

[freeforall]

This is well documented before. In normal mode at most speeds the car drives in 2nd gear and downshifts (which is very noticable) depending on the speed and pedal position. And it is not that easy to trigger a downshift (requires close to half-pedal travel in most speeds). The only mode where the car automatically picks the first gear without any torque request is sport mode (gear change is audibly noticable when sport mode is selected at low speed). Explained in detail in Porsche's technical overview (see below).

This doesn’t apply to my car, and I am guessing all RWD (at least ST) since @Gru is having the same.
The only way to engage 2nd gear for me is to turn the knob to Range mode.

 

[whitex]

2nd gear at low speed is only under Range mode, 1st gear in all other modes (Normal, Sport and Sport +)

2nd gear in Normal for my 2023 Turbo CT, unless I slam the accelerator hard. 1st gear for Sport and SportPlus until over 50mph. Going up to 50mph will stay in 1st on Sport, switching to Normal and then back to Sport changes to 2nd where it will stay unless I slow down.

 

[Avantgarde]

How do you know if your car is not engaged in second gear? It is not that easy to distinguish which gear you are on (except in Gen2 with the performance view). The best way to test is gradually get to 25-30mph constant speed then slam the accelerator, you should get a very clear "kick-down" after maybe a split second delay. This is the exact behavior I get with my RWD PB+.

This doesn’t apply to my car, and I am guessing all RWD (at least ST) since @Gru is having the same.
The only way to engage 2nd gear for me is to turn the knob to Range mode.

This doesn’t apply to my car, and I am guessing all RWD (at least ST) since @Gru is having the same.
The only way to engage 2nd gear for me is to turn the knob to Range mode.

 

[Gru]

2nd gear in Normal for my 2023 Turbo CT, unless I slam the accelerator hard. 1st gear for Sport and SportPlus until over 50mph. Going up to 50mph will stay in 1st on Sport, switching to Normal and then back to Sport changes to 2nd where it will stay unless I slow down.

true, on a Turbo CT.
but RWD has a different setting

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