Mobile Charge Connect - Is it really needed ?

[daveo4EV]

otherwise excellent charger.

LOL - honestly - ROFL

https://www.taycanforum.com/forum/threads/ditch-the-pmcc-for-now.1996/

Sponsored

 

[Windpower]

A lot of people schedule their $3000 50 amp installation before their car even arrives based on pure imagination of how it will work. I also almost scheduled mine but of layzness did not get it done until the car arrived. Then I said let me live with Level 1 for couple weeks see how miserable it is, only to realize it is not miserable at all..

you are correct this conversion can be done but you will only get 6 miles of range per hour from the 240 set up. while that is twice the rate that he is now getting it really is nothing near what a 240 50 amp like could provide.

Last year a friend of mine bought a Tesla Y. Due to covid yada yada he couldn't get his 240v circuit installed so he started charging nightly from a 120v circuit in his garage.
Bottom line: he's been doing this since last November and is in no rush to upgrade his charging to 240v.
Every one's situation is different. I charge once a week and it takes maybe 6 hours over night using 240v at 32 amps. But for some people, charging daily is fine and 120v works.

 

[soawjo]

STD 13A 3 pin plug (1.3kW charging which I'd never choose to do)

The 3 pin 13 Amps connection could theoretically deliver 3.1 kW assuming 240 V and no losses. In practice I’ve found it’s more like 2 to 2.5 kW due to losses and not drawing the full 13 Amps

 

[kort]

Last year a friend of mine bought a Tesla Y. Due to covid yada yada he couldn't get his 240v circuit installed so he started charging nightly from a 120v circuit in his garage.
Bottom line: he's been doing this since last November and is in no rush to upgrade his charging to 240v.
Every one's situation is different. I charge once a week and it takes maybe 6 hours over night using 240v at 32 amps. But for some people, charging daily is fine and 120v works.

if your daily driving isn't a lot miles, and you don't need quick overnight charges then yes you can survive using a 120 setup, but if you are at a very low SOC it will take 1.5 to 2 days to fully charge the car.

 

[Windpower]

I can't use the Porsche Mobile charger right? Sounds like I need to buy a different 240V 16 amp charger, do you agree?

I just checked the spec on the Porsche Wall Charger (the only one I could find online). The spec shows a MINIMUM of a 15 amp circuit. At least for this charger, it sounds like you should be able to use 240v at 15 amps. I have the manual for the Porsche Mobile charger at home and can check later. Unless someone else has access to it now.
So if the charger will work on a 15 amp circuit, by reusing the wires to your garage, you can avoid the mess in installing a new circuit. You'll still need an electrician to install the 240v GFCI in your electrical box and put in a suitable outlet in your garage. But you will avoid busting up your walls (which ultimately will be more expensive then just the cost to have an electrician run the new circuit: spackle, paint, dust).

 

[daveo4EV]

if your daily driving isn't a lot miles, and you don't need quick overnight charges then yes you can survive using a 120 setup, but if you are at a very low SOC it will take 1.5 to 2 days to fully charge the car.

agreed

if you're relying on L1 overnight charging at want 85% SOC in the morning - assuming a 8-10 hour charging window - you can only get down to about 60% SOC during the day - so you can only use about 25% of your available battery on a daily basis if you want to start every day back at 85%

 

[daveo4EV]

Porsche wall charger is a 3 wire charger (no 4th wire required or supported) - hard wired - no plug - it's a $1500 charger that can be hardwired to most any 240V north american circuit and can be set for a wide range of breaker sizes (AMP) - 15 amp breaker is it's minimum setting

you can buy a ClipperCreek hardwired 20 amp charger for about 1/3rd that cost

or you can buy a Mustart mobile charger with a 5-20 and/or 6-20 adapter for $400 or less…

Tesla UMC gen 2 is $300 or less - adpater for 5-20/6-20 are $35 each and you then need a TeslaTap - but that's generically useful for when you're away from home so you should have one of those anyways…

this problem can be solved for $500 or less…but not much less than $300…

 

[daveo4EV]

https://store.clippercreek.com/leve...0p-plug-in-16-amp-level-2-evse-240v-nema-6-50

this is a 16 amp charger (20 amp breaker) that plugs into a 3 wire 6-50 outlet

here is a rough outline of how to do this:

• your existing 5-15 plug has 3 wires - most likely 12 or 14 gauge wire - 12 would be better
• turn off the power to your home
• find the breaker that "feeds" your EV plug
• purchase a 240V 20 amp breaker for your electrical box ($50 or less)
• take out the 120V breaker - and replace it with the 240V breaker
• wire the two high voltage wires (hot + neutral) from the previous breaker to the new breaker
• at the "plug" end of the circuit - swap the NEMA 5-15 plug socket for a NEMA 6-50 plug socket ($50 or less)
• wire up the NEMA 6-50 outlet
• mount the ClipperCreek charger on the wall near the 6-50 plug
• safely restore power once both ends of the circuit are wired up
• test the circuit for power flow (test hot-1 + ground, test hot-2 + ground, test hot-1 + hot-2) with a multi-meter
• if circuit is working
• plug in the Clipper Creek charger
• and volia you're done - you can now charge at 240V * 16 amps or 3.84 kW
• label the 6-50 plug with a laminated sign - 20 amp _ONLY_ - EVSE ONLY - future owners will not confuse the 6-50 outlet for a 50 amp circuit
• DO NOT MAKE THESE CHANGES IF THIS CIRCUIT IS SHARED - i.e. if there is more than one outlet serviced by this breaker - other devices/appliances sharing this circuit may not tolerate 240V

I could do this in about 3 hours - should take no more than a day once you have all the suppllies from home depot

or you can purchase a mobile EVSE like the mustart for $400 or less, make the wiring changes in the breaker box- and simply plug the Mustart into the existing outlet via a plug adapter.

 

[daveo4EV]

Thanks, this feels like a safer route than trying to connect PMC+ to to 6-20 outlet via some adapter. It's just odd that porsche would not make an adapter for an otherwise excellent charger.

also the PMC+ will never use 16 amps - it's either a 12 amp or 24 amp device - porsche has no supply cable or setting for 20 amp breaker

so the PMC+ can only be 1 of the following 6 amp settings in this scenario

• NEMA 5-15 supply cable - 12 amps
• NEMA 5-15 supply cable + 1/2 setting button - 6 amps
• NEMa 6-30 supply cable - 24 amps
• NEMA 6-30 supply cable + 1/2 settings button - 12 amps
• NEMA 6-50 supply cable - 40 amps
• NEMA 6-50 supply cable + 1/2 setting - 20 amps

there is no configuration in which I can envision with a Porsche supply cable that you can get a PMC+ into a 16 amp configuration (20 amp breaker)

 

[W1NGE]

The 3 pin 13 Amps connection could theoretically deliver 3.1 kW assuming 240 V and no losses. In practice I’ve found it’s more like 2 to 2.5 kW due to losses and not drawing the full 13 Amps

Sorry you are quite correct - 3.1kW.

 

[Windpower]

I have no idea how the Juice box would use the 4th wire neutral
...
the Juice box may be using the 4th wire for it's own internal electronics to run 120V functions inside the juice box

I believe the electronics in the Juicebox (wifi, scheduler, etc.) run off a 120v power supply. My Juicebox sends time of use information to my local power company so I get a discount on my charging usage if I charge off peak. The power company (PSEG) supports both Juicebox and Chargepoint but not any of the Tesla EVSE's.

 

[soamz]

My building Tesla point is using 16amp 240v 3kW point and I get 22km/hour on my Tesla model 3 LR.

Taycan comes with 22Kw on board AC charger now standard, so I assume I should be able to get at least 30-35km/hour charge juice from Porsche 11kw standard charger.

 

[W1NGE]

My building Tesla point is using 16amp 240v 3kW point and I get 22km/hour on my Tesla model 3 LR.

Taycan comes with 22Kw on board AC charger now standard, so I assume I should be able to get at least 30-35km/hour charge juice from Porsche 11kw standard charger.

You will get the same as the Tesla and it is irrelevant what onboard AC charger you have if the maximum available power is 3kW. 11kW or 22kW AC charger will charge at the same rate in this scenario.

Not an ideal home setup as I've highlighted before.

 

[Avantgarde]

I just checked the spec on the Porsche Wall Charger (the only one I could find online). The spec shows a MINIMUM of a 15 amp circuit. At least for this charger, it sounds like you should be able to use 240v at 15 amps. I have the manual for the Porsche Mobile charger at home and can check later. Unless someone else has access to it now.
So if the charger will work on a 15 amp circuit, by reusing the wires to your garage, you can avoid the mess in installing a new circuit. You'll still need an electrician to install the 240v GFCI in your electrical box and put in a suitable outlet in your garage. But you will avoid busting up your walls (which ultimately will be more expensive then just the cost to have an electrician run the new circuit: spackle, paint, dust).

Thanks you seem to appreciate where I am coming from. I do know that PMC+ accepts 15amps, its just they don't have a proper adapter cable. Honestly surprised this is not a more common need, given electric cable gauge is driven by amps not voltage, which makes converting a household 115V to a 15 of 20 amp level 2 way more simpler vs 40-50 amp set up which would require rewiring. Understand you won't get the absolute fastest speed, but once you hit 80-100 miles charge rate overnight, faster speeds become irrelevant for many.

 

[Windpower]

I do know that PMC+ accepts 15amps, its just they don't have a proper adapter cable.

I'd need to check the electrical code (your electrician or local code enforcement might know as well), but its possible that if you have a 20 amp GFCI in your electrical panel and you have 20 amp wire going to your garage, you can install a 14-50 outlet and plug the PMC+ into that (the PMC+ comes with a 14-50 plug).
You will need to set the PMC+ to a max of 16 amps (80% of the circuits rated 20 amps).
When you do this, you'd want to label the 14-50 outlet with words like "Maximum 20 amps" in case in the future someone wants to plug a 50 amp load into that 14-50 outlet. In my garage, the 14-50 plug is labeled "Maximum 40 amps".

Edit: I just found the code and with a 14-50 outlet (receptacle) you can use either 40amp or 50amp wiring. So it looks like 20 amp is a no go. You'd need to install a 6-20 outlet.

Sponsored