Do I need the onboard 150kW/400V adapter to charge at Tesla Supercharger (when it becomes available)

[simcity]

It could be a good source of revenue for Tesla. $0.99 per month per non-Tesla EV account being open, then regular prices per KWh. Tesla does not sell electricity at cost even to Tesla cars, there is profit there too. Most non-Tesla EVs will rarely or never go, but will probably keep paying $0.99 per month to have the account ready to use.

£10.99 per month here for membership. You guys (as usual) get the cheapest prices on the planet ?

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[W1NGE]

Does that mean that you do have the 400V 150 kW adapter installed in your car or do you get that charge rate without the 150 kW adapter?

Without the 400v 150kW option (actually a DC to DC booster from 400v to 800v and not an adapter) you can charge at a max of 50kW at EVSEs which are rated at 400v and offer >= 50kW (eg some Tesla and others depending on region)..

Many ultra fast DC EVSEs are 800v and as the native battery architecture of the Taycan is 800v then any EVSE rated at 800v offering anything up to 350kW can be used.

This is not something you really need to worry about as the car will handle the actual charging capability regardless of EVSE voltage and power just plug in and go.

In UK / Europe 400v 150kW EVSEs are quite common (some Tesla Superchargers, BP, ESB, etc) and so there are more opportunities to take advantage of this cheap option. My understanding is that the opportunity may be less in US.

If specxing a car from new I would tick the option and if buying second hand I would probably choose a car with the option over one that didn't if the cars were similar in other respects. Absolutely not a deal breaker if you don't have it.

 

[whitex]

£10.99 per month here for membership. You guys (as usual) get the cheapest prices on the planet ?

$0.99 came from a Tesla App leak. Possibly it’s only a placeholder value, or really will be $0.99 to start since there are only a handful of CCS equipped superchargers in the USA/Canada. I wouldn’t be surprised if it went up as more superchargers become CCS accessible, though at $11 a month I see people not keeping it year round, only buying it when going on trips, unless they need daily charging at Tesla.

 

[Scandinavian]

£10.99 per month here for membership. You guys (as usual) get the cheapest prices on the planet ?

Euro 12.99 per month here and the rates are € 0.79 with out membership and €0.67 with membership. So you really need to charge regularly for this yo pay off. Ionity rates for Porsche is still €0.33/kWh. No time based fee either.

 

[simcity]

$0.99 came from a Tesla App leak. Possibly it’s only a placeholder value, or really will be $0.99 to start since there are only a handful of CCS equipped superchargers in the USA/Canada. I wouldn’t be surprised if it went up as more superchargers become CCS accessible, though at $11 a month I see people not keeping it year round, only buying it when going on trips, unless they need daily charging at Tesla.

There’s around 100 Tesla Supercharger locations here with around 1000 posts in total. All are CCS equipped as that’s the defacto standard in Europe, however so far only 12 locations have been be opened to non-Tesla cars.

It appears to me that more new SC’s are installed “side-by-side” placement of the tombstones, rather than the Tesla traditional “centred / end of bay” position - presumably to make them more universal in the future and reducing stall blocking - something the Teslarati get very upset about.

 

[whitex]

Many ultra fast DC EVSEs are 800v
...

Minor correction, 800V DC chargers are actual chargers, not EVSE. EVSE supplies power to a charger in the car, the DC charger takes on the same role as the charger in the car. EVSE is just a glorified extension cable, adding safety functionality to prevent electrocution, and in some cases scheduling, load balancing (signaling only, it doesn't really enforce the charging current, only suggests limits), etc.

Fun fact, original Tesla superchargers were just 12 (IRRC) car chargers stacked together. Model S (the only Teslas sold at the time) use 1 or 2 of those same charger (1 gave you 40A AC charging, 2 gave you 80A AC charging). One of my Teslas has 2 of those chargers (hence it's 80A capable). The newer models changed that (went to a single 48A or 72A charger, and I presume superchargers got their own design, but maybe not).

 

[simcity]

Euro 12.99 per month here and the rates are € 0.79 with out membership and €0.67 with membership. So you really need to charge regularly for this yo pay off. Ionity rates for Porsche is still €0.33/kWh. No time based fee either.

Somewhere between 10p and 15p discount here depending on the location (and time of day). So yeah doing the maths you’d need to do between 1 and 2 full charges per month to recoup your sub. charge.

I think our (UK) electricity prices generally must be some of the highest in Europe.

 

[whitex]

There’s around 100 Tesla Supercharger locations here with around 1000 posts in total. All are CCS equipped as that’s the defacto standard in Europe, however so far only 12 locations have been be opened to non-Tesla cars.

It appears to me that more new SC’s are installed “side-by-side” placement of the tombstones, rather than the Tesla traditional “centred / end of bay” position - presumably to make them more universal in the future and reducing stall blocking - something the Teslarati get very upset about.

Then the price difference makes sense, as there are more than 10x the CCS Tesla chargers where you live as compared to USA.

 

[W1NGE]

Minor correction, 800V DC chargers are actual chargers, not EVSE. EVSE supplies power to a charger in the car, the DC charger takes on the same role as the charger in the car. EVSE is just a glorified extension cable, adding safety functionality to prevent electrocution, and in some cases scheduling, load balancing (signaling only, it doesn't really enforce the charging current, only suggests limits), etc.

Fun fact, original Tesla superchargers were just 12 (IRRC) car chargers stacked together. Model S (the only Teslas sold at the time) use 1 or 2 of those same charger (1 gave you 40A AC charging, 2 gave you 80A AC charging). One of my Teslas has 2 of those chargers (hence it's 80A capable). The newer models changed that (went to a single 48A or 72A charger, and I presume superchargers got their own design, but maybe not).

Not sure that's correct. Charging is performed by the car in all cases.

 

[gusone]

The real question is do you want to pay Elon's nose bleed prices so he can buy Twitter?

 

[daveo4EV]

Taycan without this option can still charge at 400V stations, just at 50kw max. With this feature, it can theoretically go up to 150kw but realistically the car will not charge at the max rate depending on soc, battery temp etc...

I used a 150kw charger before and got about 75kw max.

i often get 175 kw at 150 kw chargers

 

[whitex]

Not sure that's correct. Charging is performed by the car in all cases.

I take it back, EVSE definition is very loose and wide, so DC charger can be called a Level 3 EVSE.

That said, DC chargers bypass the car's onboard charger. DC charger connects directly to the battery, with the voltage and current regulation happening outside the car, though requested by the car. Another way to put it:

• L1/L2 charging: EVSE connects power, communicates maximum current, then the car converts it to DC, decides how much current to push into the battery, and actually regulates the voltage and current draw as needed.
• L3 charging. EVSE both delivers power and regulates the voltage and current. The car still decides on the parameters, but AC-DC conversion and actual regulation occurs in the EVSE rather than the car.

So I guess what charges the battery depends on what how you define charging - is it choosing the charging parameters (voltage/current), or is it actually controlling/regulating the voltage and current to make sure it's what you need to push electrons into the battery.

 

[W1NGE]

I take it back, EVSE definition is very loose and wide, so DC charger can be called a Level 3 EVSE.

That said, DC chargers bypass the car's onboard charger. DC charger connects directly to the battery, with the voltage and current regulation happening outside the car, though requested by the car. Another way to put it:

• L1/L2 charging: EVSE connects power, communicates maximum current, then the car converts it to DC, decides how much current to push into the battery, and actually regulates the voltage and current draw as needed.
• L3 charging. EVSE both delivers power and regulates the voltage and current. The car still decides on the parameters, but AC-DC conversion and actual regulation occurs in the EVSE rather than the car.

So I guess what charges the battery depends on what how you define charging - is it choosing the charging parameters (voltage/current), or is it actually controlling/regulating the voltage and current to make sure it's what you need to push electrons into the battery.

No worries.

Actually an EVSE (Electric Vehicle Supply Equipment) is never a charger as there is no need for it to be. EVSEs (AC / DC) serve a simple purpose and that is to supply a stable and reliable flow electricity safely to your EV.

All EVs have onboard charging.

An EVSE can never be a “charger’ therefore.

I don’t believe the L1/2/3 categorisation alters this in any way but I could be partly wrong here.

 

[whitex]

No worries.

Actually an EVSE (Electric Vehicle Supply Equipment) is never a charger as there is no need for it to be. EVSEs (AC / DC) serve a simple purpose and that is to supply a stable and reliable flow electricity safely to your EV.

All EVs have onboard charging.

An EVSE can never be a “charger’ therefore.

I don’t believe the L1/2/3 categorisation alters this in any way but I could be partly wrong here.

L3 EVSE includes an onboard charger and connects straight to the EV battery, Taycan onboard charger is only 9.6KW or 19.2KW capable (USA specs). An external DC charger can charge it up to 350KW, but there is no 350KW onboard charger in a Taycan. Taycan has software which controls either the internal DC charger when using AC or the external DC charger when using DC.

 

[BigBob]

Does anyone know if the Osprey 150kw EVSEs are 800 or 400v?
Same question for MFGs 150kw EVSEs?

(question written by a donut who wasn’t given decent advice on why the 150kw onboard charger was a good idea! And bought the 22kw thingy instead).

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