GTS Ride Quality with or without Active Ride

[Fun TC Driving]

Correction to an ealirer post of mine, for now one cannot get a GTS with all season tires other than in 20” wheel diameter (whether PAR is selected or not).

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[prj]

I agree about Turbo front end looks. I’ll be getting it through salary sacrifice so cost of GTS with PAR is the same as Turbo without, within £80/month. It’s down to handling and benefit of active ride or performance of Turbo which is still way faster with push to pass. I currently have a J1.1 Turbo CT so performance similar to the J1.2 GTS. I do like performance and would be happy for it be quicker. That said, sacrificing performance for handling is also important . Just to through into the mix, considering the new Cayenne Turbo EV as well. Same price. More future proof in terms of battery tech and slightly more practical. Would need to drive before making final decision. But I really love the Taycan, sitting low and the way it drives. It would be hard to give up for an SUV. I also have a Boxster GTS 4.0 so get my kicks from that too.

I mean - you can always get our performance upgrade for 2.5k and it's going to make J1.2 Turbo S level power. Even a Taycan 4 does, as they went with the same exact hardware from the Taycan 4 to the Turbo and the Turbo S is detuned so that the Turbo GT is faster 0-60.

I appreciate if you don't want to mess with the car of course, but it's also simple enough to do. It is also why I have a Taycan 4

 

[Beattie]

I mean - you can always get our performance upgrade for 2.5k and it's going to make J1.2 Turbo S level power. Even a Taycan 4 does, as they went with the same exact hardware from the Taycan 4 to the Turbo and the Turbo S is detuned so that the Turbo GT is faster 0-60.

I appreciate if you don't want to mess with the car of course, but it's also simple enough to do. It is also why I have a Taycan 4

It will be a lease car so wouldn’t be able to change anything.

 

[prj]

It will be a lease car so wouldn’t be able to change anything.

Haven't stopped many of our customers. Some have leased multiple cars and carried the module over into the next vehicle as well.

Anyway, the GTS with push to pass is significantly quicker than the J1.1 Turbo. This is because the GTS has 700 PS when the button is pressed while the J1.1 Turbo has 625 PS.

Additionally it makes a lot more power with a cold battery or at lower states of charge, so in real world scenarios the car is much quicker.
I'd argue this makes for a bigger difference than the straight up power increase.

 

[prj]

Funny enough since my car went to the dealer, my loaner is a J1.1 GTS today.
It has 21" Spyders with Michelin Pilot Alpin tyres. The speed bumps are not fun after getting used to the CT gliding over them. The 21" wheels transmit significantly more vibrations. The chassis is also tuned quite sporty in normal mode, but not a significant difference to a turbo on 21", just as I remember from before.

 

[Alain13]

Where you in Normal mode? The modes make a difference with PAR.

On the Weissach, I don't drive it on Normal because it feels a little too soft for me, unless it's horrible road.

Daily drive in Range for less suspension play

Have you ever driven a J1.2 GTS with PAR for comparison?

I noticed the marketing for the GTS specifically mentions a 'GTS specific tune' for the Active Ride system, while the Turbo GT (Weissach) page just shows the generic PAR description.

Since you find the GT in Normal 'too soft', I'm wondering if the GTS in Normal might actually be stiffer/more communicative by design or (hopefully not) even softer? Or do you think they share the same base calibration?

 

[Mr.Smith]

Have you ever driven a J1.2 GTS with PAR for comparison?

I noticed the marketing for the GTS specifically mentions a 'GTS specific tune' for the Active Ride system, while the Turbo GT (Weissach) page just shows the generic PAR description.

Since you find the GT in Normal 'too soft', I'm wondering if the GTS in Normal might actually be stiffer/more communicative by design or (hopefully not) even softer? Or do you think they share the same base calibration?

I have not driven a J1.2 GTS with PAR. I'm going to try and do that

 

[dcp10]

I have not driven a J1.2 GTS with PAR. I'm going to try and do that

It would be good to get more feedback on this. I felt that the GTS J1.2 with PAR in “Normal” was a little too stiff.

 

[prj]

Have you ever driven a J1.2 GTS with PAR for comparison?

I noticed the marketing for the GTS specifically mentions a 'GTS specific tune' for the Active Ride system, while the Turbo GT (Weissach) page just shows the generic PAR description.

Since you find the GT in Normal 'too soft', I'm wondering if the GTS in Normal might actually be stiffer/more communicative by design or (hopefully not) even softer? Or do you think they share the same base calibration?

The GTS is not tuned stiffer than the Turbo GT Weissach.
The main issue for those who don't have good roads (Mr. Smth is in California so their roads are almost perfect) is the small bumps/cracks that really make for a jarring ride with 21" wheels combined with UHP tyres. The Dynamics package has Tyres with extra stiff sidewalls.

The softness comes mostly from the body motion "floaty ride", which there is some in normal. PAR does not really affect the feeling of the smaller unevenness much at all.
There you have first and foremost the wheels/tyres and then the damper setting.

Comparing two cross turismos - J1.1 with PDCC and J1.2 without (but with the 2 chamber air suspension), they drive very similarly with the 21" Wheels/Tyres.
If you compare that to a CT with PAR, then the main feeling is similar, but as soon as you have larger bumps or side-to-side unevenness then the PAR makes that super smooth. Additionally the non-PAR CT's have quite a bit of body roll compared to the sedans, even the Turbo S. But my J1.2 CT4 with PAR has zero body roll.

The J1.1 GTS sedan in Normal feels like a J1.1 CT between sport and sport plus or a J1.1 Turbo between normal and sport. J1.2 GTS felt very similar to me, I drove it in Germany.
All this pales in comparison with 20" vs 21" on crappy roads though. The 20" just cuts out all the small judder and chatter and smooths the ride right out. But of course the performance on the 21" UHP is much better as well. Is it important enough to have them on a daily driver? Not for me on the crappy roads we have.

 

[Alain13]

I have not driven a J1.2 GTS with PAR. I'm going to try and do that

That would be great, thanks!

To give some context on my reference frame: I previously owned a Model S P85+ and a Model X on 22s. While my family was perfectly happy with them on long European trips, I personally found them too soft/floaty. I never really felt connected to the road.

I currently drive a Model Y Performance on 21s. It’s harsh, yes, but I prefer that planted/direct feeling over the floating sensation of the air-suspended Teslas. And surprisingly, my family is perfectly fine with this stiffer setup as well.

So, I am actually hoping the GTS with PAR is comparable to your experience with the GT: rigid body control (zero float), but with the sophistication of Porsche damping to round off the sharp edges.

@dcp10 - Your 'too stiff' observation is actually reassuring for me. Since I'm used to the MYP on 21s, I was worried the GTS might be too soft/compliant. If it leans towards stiff, that sounds like a match.

@prj - Your distinction between impact harshness (tyres) and body motion (float) is spot on. I can live with the impact harshness, but I want to eliminate that float.

 

[prj]

If you are okay with the Model Y Performance, then any Taycan is a huge upgrade in ride quality.
You don't need the GTS. You can also get a non-GTS and keep it in e.g. Sport - it won't be floaty, the floatiness is really only there in normal on non-gts. You only really want the GTS if the sport plus on other trims is not enough for you and you want it even stiffer. If you're never in sport plus, then just set everything up one notch and you have a similar experience to the GTS.

For the floatiness it's just how aggressive the damper rebound is set more than anything, whether after the bump the suspension attempts to set the car neutral as fast as possible or allows it to perform some oscillations. This you can perfectly control using the mode toggle.

 

[Mr.Smith]

That would be great, thanks!

To give some context on my reference frame: I previously owned a Model S P85+ and a Model X on 22s. While my family was perfectly happy with them on long European trips, I personally found them too soft/floaty. I never really felt connected to the road.

I currently drive a Model Y Performance on 21s. It’s harsh, yes, but I prefer that planted/direct feeling over the floating sensation of the air-suspended Teslas. And surprisingly, my family is perfectly fine with this stiffer setup as well.

So, I am actually hoping the GTS with PAR is comparable to your experience with the GT: rigid body control (zero float), but with the sophistication of Porsche damping to round off the sharp edges.

@dcp10 - Your 'too stiff' observation is actually reassuring for me. Since I'm used to the MYP on 21s, I was worried the GTS might be too soft/compliant. If it leans towards stiff, that sounds like a match.

@prj - Your distinction between impact harshness (tyres) and body motion (float) is spot on. I can live with the impact harshness, but I want to eliminate that float.

I should have given context on my expectations for suspension.

When i say floaty, its not like a Tesla or wafty like a Rolls-Royce (previous Phantom Owner). I use the Weissach as raw sports car for the streets. I'm looking into the Manthey kit for it as well.
I want it somewhere between a GT3 and where it is now.

I can't drive in a Y/3 because I will vomit from the ride. I found the S not compliant for sporty driving and the X being the best riding out of the group for its soft ride as a family SUV, not sporty driving.

You will be very pleased with the GTS, especially with PAR, coming from any Tesla. With the family you can drive in Normal mode for a more luxurious ride, when you want to drive spirited, throw it into Sport Plus.

 

[Alain13]

Thanks @Mr.Smith, that puts my mind at ease!

Knowing your 'floaty' reference is relative to a GT3 (and explicitly not a Rolls/Tesla X 'waft') confirms the GTS is likely exactly what I'm looking for.

If you do manage to get some seat time in a GTS with PAR, I’d still be very curious to hear your thoughts on how it compares to your Weissach!

 

[Beattie]

@prj thanks for your descriptions and explanations . Very helpful. I’m still not sure which I would prefer. GTS with PAR or Turbo without. I’ll be looking at sport Tourismo instead of CT which I have now. The one thing I do like with my CT is the smoothness in normal when just cruising and going over rough roads. However, when it comes to spirited driving then happy to have it firm to eliminate the floatiness which isn’t totally eliminated in my CT.

 

[RodeoDrive]

Comparing two cross turismos - J1.1 with PDCC and J1.2 without (but with the 2 chamber air suspension), they drive very similarly with the 21" Wheels/Tyres.
If you compare that to a CT with PAR, then the main feeling is similar, but as soon as you have larger bumps or side-to-side unevenness then the PAR makes that super smooth.

Detail question - does the PDCC on J1.1 sort out the side-to-side uneven road bumps - by decoupling the ARBs?
It is the one thing that annoys me on mine, granted I also have 21" but you imply 20"s won't change that?

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