I mean isn't the real question 'when will Tesla make a car with 1000 HP capable of stopping and handling like a Porsche?' The Honda Civic brake set up and the yoke steering wheel doesnt do it for me.
Tesla is all about maximum straight line acceleration. What is the complete opposite of that which you want to enjoy?
You'd be wrong there. I talked with many dealers while searching for a Taycan Turbo CT allocation (on waiting lists 10 months and counting), and they all said a very large portion of Taycan shoppers have had a Tesla (some are switching, others replacing their other ICE car).
Not so easy. The hardest part is that it would require a new generation battery (took Tesla many iterations to manage to create a battery which could deliver 1000hp and still last the full warranty period). Nobody beats Tesla's experience with batteries today - with their rapid production hardware iterations (every 2 weeks at one point), frequent OTA and fleet data collection, they've had hundreds of thousands of cars to experiment and learn on. They know better than anyone else out there what works and what doesn't, in terms of physical battery design, electronics, management strategies, etc.
For stopping part:I mean isn't the real question 'when will Tesla make a car with 1000 HP capable of stopping and handling like a Porsche?' The Honda Civic brake set up and the yoke steering wheel doesnt do it for me.
I'm not sure if the batteries are the limiting factor at this point, primarily because there are quite a few other companies that have platforms that can deliver 1000hp, or close to it, including Lucid, GMC, and Rivian (835hp). I believe the battery pack is the same between the Plaid and the Model S LR, so while there may be improvement in software management / cooling, largely I don't know if there's a huge difference. On top of that, they've fundamentally used the same 18650 cells that have been around for a while. My view is that the key limiting factor really is the motors.
Nope. Turbo S battery has an 800A built in fuse, which would blow at nominal 640KW (800V * 800A), which is 858hp (if all the power from HV battery was used by the motors, but remember that other things are powered from HV battery as well, so subtract a few hp for HVAC, etc). The actual front and rear contactors are fused with 350A each, so 700A total, which calculates to 560KW (which is the advertised max for Turbo S).
To be fair, that could all be sized based on load and not necessarily telling of maximum battery capacity.
Taycan does not use the 18650 batteries. It uses pouch cells. This is a diagram of the Audi module, but Taycan is pretty much the same. 12 pouch cells per module (6s2p).
This is German engineering so I doubt it. They design to spec, avoid overengineering because it costs more. This is why Porsche AC chargers wiring would get very warm to touch - they made the wiring only as thick as needed for safety. Could they get more power out of the same battery by just increasing the fuses and making wiring thicker? Perhaps, but that would be using the batteries out of spec, not tested for, likely nor covered by any warranties from the battery cell manufacturer.
I’m not sure why motors would be the limiting factor. Thermal concentration? Size for increased heat dissipation?
But wiring can (and probably is) also sized based on load and also not telling of maximum battery capacity.
Properly engineered system would not have a 20 amp rated supply with only 2 4A fused loads coming from it. Waste of money, unless you are derating the 20A supply to 8A max in order to extend its life. Could the Taycan battery provide 1000hp with thicker wires and higher rated fuse? Perhaps, once, maybe a few times, but it may decrease the life of the battery. Even 560KW is limited to 2.5s, so maybe 750KW could be made available for a half a second or less? Maybe in a deep freeze winter would could get a bit longer? In the end if the max power is not speced that high, if the batteries start failing, their manufacturer will not cover it under warranty either.
I'm not sure that's the case, given Porsche for their 911 Turbo S literally was tested doing 50 launch controls in a row and not breaking. Historically Porsche has always overengineered their cars - their GT products have usually been known to be one of the few cars that are track-day ready. I'm more with Jhenson29 that the fuses are likely designed to protect the motors / items downstream of the battery vs. the battery itself. BTW, wasn't able to find sourcing for the 800A fuse, would be curious if you had that handy?
Agreed, but GMC uses pouch cells as well and has said they can deliver 1000hp. It's possible they're capable of doing that because of the immense pack size - you're right in that Lucid and Rivian both use cylindrical cells. Still I'm not sure if VAG's battery cell module is that much worse than 18650 which have been around since well before the Taycan
Yes, from what I understand, pretty much a heat management thing. At higher speeds, heat increases in the motor which can cause failure. At lower speeds, there's a limit to the amount of torque a motor can safely produce, given it can only produce a certain strength of magnetic field. Trying to increase this magnetic field over the ideal value can oversaturate the core and create excess heat as well. Hence why companies have been using multiple motors to increase power and torque, vs. trying to design a motor that spins faster or has a stronger magnetic field. To me it implies that the companies are hitting a limit with current tech, which I'm sure will be improved over time like tesla did with the plaid motor
Well, that’s your opinion. We do it because we need mostly 20A power supplies for larger loads (e.g. 24VDC solenoids for hydraulic valves [small individually, but add up] and linear actuators (large on their own), but separate analog inputs on a different power supply so they aren’t affected by loads and leave them at 20A for commonality of parts and because the cost and size difference between the two is quite small.
