Charging Etiquette

[DerekS]

It's incredibly disappointing when you're road tripping...low SoC, battery warmed, ready to get a kick ass fast charge...and a Chevy Bolt at 50kW is blocking the one working 350kW pump for over an hour.

Educating these people is a lost cause, IMO.

I am very glad EA is changing the model to make all the pumps 350kW and just deliver whatever your car can accept.

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[tigerbalm]

Charge more for the 350 kW pedestals then the 150 kW is the answer. People won't be long educating themselves when money is involved. Of course, most folks at an EA station don't appear to be paying regardless – and maybe therein lies the real underlying challenge.

 

[PorscheCH]

Price discrimination is the answer, like eg. airlines. One way or another. It's early days but If/once electric cars will be mainstream, new pricing models might arise. Per minute vs kW based on thresholds, differentiation by nominal power, stall booking in advance for a fee, priority access based on whatever, etc. etc.

 

[kort]

Charge more for the 350 kW pedestals then the 150 kW is the answer. People won't be long educating themselves when money is involved. Of course, most folks at an EA station don't appear to be paying regardless – and maybe therein lies the real underlying challenge.

in the US, porsche and other manufacturers give free charging for X amount of time so there is no financial punishment available.
what EA and other vendors could do is to limit charging to those who remain plugged in X amount of time after the charge is completed.
people need to learn that they cannot occupy a charger if not charging.

 

[bsclywilly]

I wonder if charging more for faster chargers will even work. There might be a correlation between those ignorant folks who occupy 350 chargers now and people who like to pay more for higher octane gas than their car needs. Price might not dissuade them because in their minds they will still think they’re getting more out of the 350 chargers.

 

[tigerbalm]

The faster the electrons go into the battery, the faster they can come out of it. Thus turning your electric motors quicker and adding nearly 30% more horsepower to your car in everyday driving.

 

[simcity]

I am very glad EA is changing the model to make all the pumps 350kW and just deliver whatever your car can accept.

The only long term solution imho.

More stations and more of the highest capability chargers. It would be useful to see 400V/800V 'universal' architecture DC pedestals.

EV charging needs to become universal and ubiquitous like service/gas stations. Unfortunately the gestation/transition is slow and painful. Everywhere.

 

[tigerbalm]

It would be useful to see 400V/800V 'universal' architecture DC pedestals.

IONITY in Europe are happy to drop down to 400V if a car requires it. They can also go as high as 1000V – which is a bit of future proofing for 900V architecture that specialist cars might adopt.

 

[bsclywilly]

The faster the electrons go into the battery, the faster they can come out of it. Thus turning your electric motors quicker and adding nearly 30% more horsepower to your car in everyday driving.

A true conversation amongst ID4 owners

 

[simcity]

IONITY in Europe are happy to drop down to 400V if a car requires it. They can also go as high as 1000V – which is a bit of future proofing for 900V architecture that specialist cars might adopt.

Excellent to hear.

We need more Ionity (and others like them) in the UK. Only I think 3 new stations opened this year. They had a blitz of them opening in 2020 (10 stations), then went relatively quiet.

I think the EU funding dried up or some such...

 

[tigerbalm]

Excellent to hear.

We need more Ionity (and others like them) in the UK. Only I think 3 new stations opened this year. They had a blitz of them opening in 2020 (10 stations), then went relatively quiet.

I think the EU funding dried up or some such...

8 new stations currently under construction in UK: https://ionity.ev-info.eu/countries/united-kingdom

Same cannot be said for here in Ireland: https://ionity.ev-info.eu/countries/ireland

 

[simcity]

8 new stations currently under construction in UK: https://ionity.ev-info.eu/countries/united-kingdom

Same cannot be said for here in Ireland: https://ionity.ev-info.eu/countries/ireland

Wow so only one new one opened here in 2022 (Stafford in June). I had presumed without checking that Magor and Carlisle had opened, clearly the gestation is long and painful.

At least they have announced another 6 which is good.

What's the score in the Republic then with them and others?

 

[ben1]

I think educating people about the technical reasons behind it (maximum charging speeds and maximum battery level) is useless.
Now that we are past the early adopter phase, people that are totally not technically minded, are also driving EV's.
Most people are too stupid and ignorant to learn that.

The only solution that we will work is to increase the price.
Make a big sign: "Charge for 0.68 euro/kwh here at 350kw. Charge for 0.58 euro/kwh here at 150kw."
That will work. Most people will not fully understand what it actually mean or why it is like that. But the ones that do not understand it, will take the cheapest option.

Same with educating people that charge to 100%:
Put a big sign that says: "After 30min, you pay 20cent per minute"

 

[tigerbalm]

What's the score in the Republic then with them and others?

I haven't gotten the definitive answer. EV adoption is going well here. But one challenge we have is the Irish Gov has given a ton of money to the state company that maintains the grid.

They have a very impressive and comprehensive plan to dot the country with 50+ high speed charging stations. That's a lot on an island that's roughly 480 km x 280 km in size.

The problem is – well its a state company – almost everything they do is terrible: the layout of the stations, the speed of build-out, etc.

Its as if the entire company has never actually used an EV themselves – which is very possibly true. In particular the speed of buildout is way behind plans and citizens faith in catching up is not good.

The problem with all this – is private companies like IONITY don't want to compete with a state company as its too risky. Our grid company don't have as much of a profit motive and potentially have near bottomless resources. So the likes of IONITY and Tesla (check out the small number of superchargers built here over the last decade) are wary.

Of course EV owners don't care – we just want choice – but right now the "comprehensive" state plan is actually slowing things down.

My own personal conspiracy theory on all this is: gov got the grid company to build the EV stations so that private charging network providers wouldn't be publicly complaining about the unsuitability of our national grid to EV charging. The high power required just isn't where it's needed – out on the motorway's. Instead our grid was designed to serve industry – data centre's, factories and residential in towns and cities.

(end of rant)

 

[simcity]

I haven't gotten the definitive answer. EV adoption is going well here. But one challenge we have is the Irish Gov has given a ton of money to the state company that maintains the grid.

They have a very impressive and comprehensive plan to dot the country with 50+ high speed charging stations. That's a lot on an island that's roughly 480 km x 280 km in size.

The problem is – well its a state company – almost everything they do is terrible: the layout of the stations, the speed of build-out, etc.

Its as if the entire company has never actually used an EV themselves – which is very possibly true. In particular the speed of buildout is way behind plans and citizens faith in catching up is not good.

The problem with all this – is private companies like IONITY don't want to compete with a state company as its too risky. Our grid company don't have as much of a profit motive and potentially have near bottomless resources. So the likes of IONITY and Tesla (check out the small number of superchargers built here over the last decade) are wary.

Of course EV owners don't care – we just want choice – but right now the "comprehensive" state plan is actually slowing things down.

My own personal conspiracy theory on all this is: gov got the grid company to build the EV stations so that private charging network providers wouldn't be publicly complaining about the unsuitability of our national grid to EV charging. The high power required just isn't where it's needed – out on the motorway's. Instead our grid was designed to serve industry – data centre's, factories and residential in towns and cities.

(end of rant)

Really interesting read. Thank you ?

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