TAYCAN GTS REGEN BRAKING

[Gaelic Silver Fox]

I've just taken delivery of a brand new Taycan GTS, currently with 1000km on the clock. Regen braking seems to be be almost non-existent especially in comparison to my previously owned Tesla MS and Tesla M3. Does this situation change as the usage increases? Any info will be much appreciated.

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[daveo4EV]

Regen is via the brakes pedal only - not lift off the accelerator - you're getting regen but only when you use the brake pedal.

this is by design and normal - Porsche does not support heavy regen via accelerator pedal - if you want to see how muich regen you're getting you can use the 'power meter' display on your main scope and see blue vs. green bars when accelerating vs. braking - green bar on the center scope is the amount of regen

it's actually quite a bit - but only when actually applying brake pedal - Porsche software will "add" friction braking as necessary but mostly rely on regeneration when stopping the vehicle.

being able to coast with the vehicle - off the accelerator but not actually braking is an important driver control feature to manage weight transfer - this level of control is much harder with one pedal driving (effectively impossible) and not ideal for high performance driving - Porsche is a performance brand and carries this philosophy into the design of their regeneration implementation in their EV's - no high performance driver wants one pedal driving because it's effectively uncontrolled weight transfer since the effective "neutral" point (where the vehicle is coasting but not not technically braking is constantly changing in the amount of accelerator pedal) - with the Porsche if you're off the accelerator you ARE coasting no question and easy to control…

you're getting lots and lots of regen (actually more than Tesla) but only when applying the brakes vs. just lifting off the accelerator.

there are lots of existing threads on this topic - it's been extensively discussed and a key feature of the vehicle and an obvious difference between Tesla and prosche for anyone that has done even a mild amount of research regarding their 100K+ purchase.

one pedal driving is great for for around town driving, and it's a mistake for Porsche not to include as an option, but it's awful for high-performance driving and/or tracking - Porsche has decided to avoid having one pedal driving as a matter of driver control and design philosophy and they have a point - they are not wrong - but they are different.

 

[gtm]

being able to coast with the vehicle - off the accelerator but not actually braking is an important driver control feature to manage weight transfer - this level of control is much harder with one pedal driving (effectively impossible) and not ideal for high performance driving - Porsche is a performance brand and carries this philosophy into the design of their regeneration implementation in their EV's - no high performance driver wants one pedal driving because it's effectively uncontrolled weight transfer since the effective "neutral" point (where the vehicle is coasting but not not technically braking is constantly changing in the amount of accelerator pedal) - with the Porsche if you're off the accelerator you ARE coasting no question and easy to control…

Sorry @daveo4EV , respectfully disagree (and I fully acknowledge your bone fides). You have a GT3 that you frequently track if I remember correctly. How many times to you coast on the track? Weight transfer? What happens on throttle lift off? Weight transfer on lift off, weight transfer on braking, weight transfer on accelerating out of the turn. At almost no time are you coasting during "high performance driving". "Coasting" with one pedal driving is entirely possible with a sensitive right foot. One pedal driving mimics engine compression braking and actually brakes when you press the brake pedal. I would also suggest that the Taycan never really coasts. There is no mechanical decoupling of the motors that I have ever seen. Zero current to the motors would cause considerable drag. Just enough energy to the motors for there to be no engine drag/deceleration yes, but not true coasting. Nothing will truly coast the way a Taycan does. Defies physics. Also, I'm one of the relatively many that are not happy with the way the switch from regen to mechanical brakes is implemented coming to a slow stop. Loves to just suddenly "coast" at 3 mph. Very disconcerting. With one pedal driving when you press the brakes you get brakes.

Different system but please don't suggest that the way Porsche has decided to go is "the" way. There is a lot that could be improved. And, just saying, the Taycan is no track car at 5,000 lbs and overheated batteries after 15 minutes, so Porsche should concentrate on making it a great street car. But I have hope. Hanging the engine behind the rear axles was nuts many years ago yet somehow Porsche engineers got it to work extremely well. I'm hoping Gen 2 solves a few of the shortcomings.

 

[daveo4EV]

when I drove my Model 3 performance on track - I found it very very difficult to predict the amount of weight transfer when lifting off the throttle due to a very very variable amount of regen from lap to lap…with the Taycan it's very predictable…

I agree porsche shoudl support one pedal driving for street use, but there does need to be an option to defeat it - they have chosen to optimize for no regen via accelerator pedal for the predictability of it…

there is always weight transfer agree - for any change in vehicle momentum - but the amount and magnitude should be predictable and I found it very very unpredictable and highly variable in my Model 3 performance - but as with all things YMMV…

 

[Murph7355]

Regen is via the brakes pedal only - not lift off the accelerator - you're getting regen but only when you use the brake pedal.
....

I don't think this is entirely correct.

In Sport or Sport Plus mode, or with regen manual turned on (steering wheel button on the left) there is some lift off regen.

Not much. It isn't one pedal driving (both of which I suspect the OP is noticing). But there is some.

Porsche having a paddle to increase regen on the GT is, IMO, an admission that there is a place for it, no matter how much they believe coasting is more efficient. If effiiciency was really their bag, they'd be looking at why their cars are at least a third down on the best EVs more seriously ?

Not having one pedal driving is more about making the car feel like a traditional car rather than anything else. It'd be quite nice to have the option (well set up and drivers educated I reckon it should be an effective way to drive).

 

[WuffvonTrips]

I agree with @Murph7355 - default in Sport or Sport+ is relatively mild regen braking on lift-off, which IMO is beneficial on track.
EDIT- on further consideration, I recall that for the particular scenario of attempting to maintain a drift on a skid pan, I found it easier to balance on the throttle with lift-off regen disabled.

 

[Murph7355]

I think the main benefit, road or track, is that we have become conditioned to that being how a car behaves when you lift off.

Track performance driving is the exact opposite of hypermiling. The needs between the two are very different (polar opposite). Hence the GT having a choice, I suspect.

Porsche could have done the same with every Taycan. Kia have with the EV9 ?

If our brains were reconfigured, and the cars configured to suit (to be fair, very difficult when you think about), one pedal driving should be great for track driving as there's only one physical body transition to make.

The challenge is in that tuning. There's a limit to pedal travel, and pootling down to the supermarket needs different parameters to banging out a fast lap on the 'ring. And a car is not telepathic wrt what the driver wants at any given time ?

 

[W1NGE]

I don't think this is entirely correct.

In Sport or Sport Plus mode, or with regen manual turned on (steering wheel button on the left) there is some lift off regen.

Not much. It isn't one pedal driving (both of which I suspect the OP is noticing). But there is some.

Porsche having a paddle to increase regen on the GT is, IMO, an admission that there is a place for it, no matter how much they believe coasting is more efficient. If effiiciency was really their bag, they'd be looking at why their cars are at least a third down on the best EVs more seriously ?

Not having one pedal driving is more about making the car feel like a traditional car rather than anything else. It'd be quite nice to have the option (well set up and drivers educated I reckon it should be an effective way to drive).

Correct - Porsche call it "overrun recuperation" (same as an ICE motor and uses the motors (engine(s)) for braking and therefore some energy recuperation. As you move up the drive modes it becomes a little more aggressive.

I think it's great and much prefer to have manual recup on rather than off however the jury's out if this can reduce range more than it adds as coasting ability is significantly impaired as a consequence.

 

[Jhenson29]

however the jury's out if this can reduce range more than it adds as coasting ability is significantly impaired as a consequence.

Jury is not out on that….?

 

[Jhenson29]

Zero current to the motors would cause considerable drag.

I don’t think it would. I guess it depends on how you define considerable. I would describe it as minimal though. The motor bearings will be extremely minimal. Most of it will be in the gearbox, which I still don’t think would be “considerable”.

Just commenting based on my experience.

https://www.taycanforum.com/forum/t...ansmission-a-good-idea.6598/page-3#post-94709

 

[ShiftyWolf]

All this talk about one pedal driving but Porsche actually used to offer three pedal driving in many of their vehicles. They seem to be moving away from that too, however.

 

[Rossmeldr]

Just remember that the Taycan is a Porsche that just happens to be electric. Buy it because it’s a bloody good sports car, not because you want an electric car. It’s not meant to compete with or be compared to a Tesla.

 

[JAGMAN]

…and now we are all exhausted…

 

[Marcy]

I've just taken delivery of a brand new Taycan GTS, currently with 1000km on the clock. Regen braking seems to be be almost non-existent especially in comparison to my previously owned Tesla MS and Tesla M3. Does this situation change as the usage increases? Any info will be much appreciated.
[/"The regenerative braking of the Taycan will start to function after approximately 2000 kilometers of driving. Please rest assured."

I've just taken delivery of a brand new Taycan GTS, currently with 1000km on the clock. Regen braking seems to be be almost non-existent especially in comparison to my previously owned Tesla MS and Tesla M3. Does this situation change as the usage increases? Any info will be much appreciated.

The regenerative braking of the Taycan will start to function after approximately 2000 kilometers of driving. Please rest assured.

 

[W1NGE]

Kicks in much sooner than mentioned < 1K miles or clicks - not aggressive recuperation, increases depending on Drive Mode selected (greatest in Sport Plus).

If you see the green bar on the speed when you brake then you are getting braking recuperation. Normally starts after 1 - 2 miles from cold.

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