Redshift vs MapEV

[whitex]

Turbo s.

If your accelerator never hits the floor in your daily drives, then not faster at all. If you only mash your Turbo S go pedal to the metal from a standstill with LC activated (at red lights I presume), again not faster. If however your accelerator hits the floor at other times, then noticeably more powerful.

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[freinando]

If however your accelerator hits the floor at other times, then noticeably more powerful.

I’m not sure this is accurate. I rarely fully floor my car due to PTSD caused by the original inverters (now fixed) and the difference in power is very noticeable. It seems you’re suggesting the power increase comes only when LC is activated (full pedal). I speak from what I perceive but I could be wrong. You are also speaking about a Turbo S, maybe the behavior is different from the 4S.

 

[whitex]

I’m not sure this is accurate. I rarely fully floor my car due to PTSD caused by the original inverters (now fixed) and the difference in power is very noticeable. It seems you’re suggesting the power increase comes only when LC is activated (full pedal). I speak from what I perceive but I could be wrong. You are also speaking about a Turbo S, maybe the behavior is different from the 4S.

Actually, what I meant was if the go pedal doesn't hit the floor, that indicates that the driver is getting sufficient power response from the car already and doesn't need any more. What you are describing may be due to a different throttle mapping (disabled adaptive mapping perhaps)?

 

[freinando]

What you are describing may be due to a different throttle mapping

There’s a bit of that as well. I get your point, the only thing I’d say is just because the driver isn’t inputting more throttle doesn’t necessarily mean they don’t want more power. When you know the limits of your car, sometimes you know trying to demand for more is just pointless in terms of 1, how quickly you get it, and 2, how much you end up with.

 

[69Mach390]

There’s a bit of that as well. I get your point, the only thing I’d say is just because the driver isn’t inputting more throttle doesn’t necessarily mean they don’t want more power. When you know the limits of your car, sometimes you know trying to demand for more is just pointless in terms of 1, how quickly you get it, and 2, how much you end up with.

Yeah what you’re feeling and describing is the more aggressive throttle mapping. Its definitely noticeable and makes the car more fun to drive.

Not sure why Porsche made the stock throttle mapping so conservative.

My last car (Mach e GTPE) was significantly more responsive at part throttle despite having less power.

 

[prj]

I remember reading somewhere that the OEM launch mode only gets 2-3 seconds of additional power before reverting back to the non power level. Does your tune remove this restriction?

Torque, not power. Power is always the same in launch mode on J1.1 regardless of how long you hold it down.

Yeah what you’re feeling and describing is the more aggressive throttle mapping. Its definitely noticeable and makes the car more fun to drive.

Not sure why Porsche made the stock throttle mapping so conservative.

My last car (Mach e GTPE) was significantly more responsive at part throttle despite having less power.

It's not really more aggressive, it's linear, but stock it has to be linear to 500hp, but tuned it has to go to 730hp.
So as a result it may seem more aggressive, but it's just linearized so it's not like an on/off switch at full throttle.

You do have more power at 60%, 70% 80% and so on. It's not only when you mash the foot to the floor that you get a power increase
So the car remains controllable for stuff other than drag racing.

 

[freinando]

Torque, not power. Power is always the same in launch mode on J1.1 regardless of how long you hold it down.

So to see if I got this right. When the tune puts the inverters in LC mode (full throttle), what we’re getting there is the increased torque.
That means, taking the J1.1 4S as an example, when not flooring it you get the usual 640nm, but the ability to produce that torque at higher speeds (rpm) is the gain (power). When flooring it you get the added 20nm and power is up a bit too as a function or is basically the same?

 

[69Mach390]

Torque, not power. Power is always the same in launch mode on J1.1 regardless of how long you hold it down.


It's not really more aggressive, it's linear, but stock it has to be linear to 500hp, but tuned it has to go to 730hp.
So as a result it may seem more aggressive, but it's just linearized so it's not like an on/off switch at full throttle.

You do have more power at 60%, 70% 80% and so on. It's not only when you mash the foot to the floor that you get a power increase
So the car remains controllable for stuff other than drag racing.

I definitely like the throttle mapping of the tune.

Is it really accurate to say you have “more power” at part throttle though?

Until you exceed the stock power and torque limits with the tune, you could theoretically get the identical power stock just by pushing the pedal down more.

Yes, the car will accelerate faster at with the tune at 50% throttle for example. But couldn’t you get the same “power” stock just by pushing the pedal to 60% or so?

Agreed that it’s very controllable. The only time the car ever feels a little out of control is in normal mode when it downshifts unexpectedly at 50-75% throttle. But that was true for the stock tune too. It’s unnerving if you aren’t expecting the violent downshift vs the very linear response of the car otherwise.

 

[Gru]

I can't tell you exact numbers, because I have not tested that specific range myself. But I would expect a roughly 25% reduction in the time.

exact.
2.6s vs 3.5s.

 

[whitex]

Not sure why Porsche made the stock throttle mapping so conservative.

Fun fact. Your Taycan has adaptive throttle mapping (at least J1.1, in Sport and SportPlus AFAIK), where the car learns from your driving style. I disabled the adaptive mapping for SportPlus+, but kept it for Sport. It turns out, the learned throttle response on Sport is actually more aggressive than the disabled adaptive in Sport+. It kind of makes sense, as I drive in Sport around town and my style of driving is fast accelerations but gentle braking (a habit I picked up as a 17 year old driving a 2 seater car, with my school books on the front seat - any harder braking and I had to pick up the books from the floor, acceleration was no problem though, neither was cornering as the seats had side supports holding the books pretty well).

So perhaps the conservative throttle mapping you are experiencing based on your driving style?

 

[Taycan4S_UK]

I’m 10 days into the wolf on sheep clothing club with MapEV (J1.1 4S). The car feels amazing, and when I’m not driving like a maniac I still get my usual mi/kwh consumption. e.g 3.1 mi/kwh reported on a 25 mile drive this morning.

Would love to hear more about your experience and how the tune affects each mode. I also have a 4S.

 

[prj]

So to see if I got this right. When the tune puts the inverters in LC mode (full throttle), what we’re getting there is the increased torque.
That means, taking the J1.1 4S as an example, when not flooring it you get the usual 640nm, but the ability to produce that torque at higher speeds (rpm) is the gain (power). When flooring it you get the added 20nm and power is up a bit too as a function or is basically the same?

Power is up during the area where there is increased torque, but the peak torque is only there for a certain amount of time, after which because the power is constant the torque goes down and it stops mattering.

Fun fact. Your Taycan has adaptive throttle mapping (at least J1.1, in Sport and SportPlus AFAIK), where the car learns from your driving style. I disabled the adaptive mapping for SportPlus+, but kept it for Sport. It turns out, the learned throttle response on Sport is actually more aggressive than the disabled adaptive in Sport+. It kind of makes sense, as I drive in Sport around town and my style of driving is fast accelerations but gentle braking (a habit I picked up as a 17 year old driving a 2 seater car, with my school books on the front seat - any harder braking and I had to pick up the books from the floor, acceleration was no problem though, neither was cornering as the seats had side supports holding the books pretty well).

So perhaps the conservative throttle mapping you are experiencing based on your driving style?

There is no such thing, I am not sure what you're talking about.
There is only one pedal to wheel torque map in the software for forward gears, and the differences in response are based on the antisurge damper mapping, which defines how much filtering there is on the pedal.
There is nothing adaptive at all about it.

 

[prj]

I definitely like the throttle mapping of the tune.

Is it really accurate to say you have “more power” at part throttle though?

You have more power at a given throttle position. So you have more torque requested than before at the same throttle position.
At 80% you have more power than you would have had stock at 100%.

So the "push the pedal more" logic works until around 75%, but that's not what I was talking about. I purely meant the amount of torque as the function of where the accelerator is.

 

[whitex]

There is no such thing, I am not sure what you're talking about.
There is only one pedal to wheel torque map in the software for forward gears, and the differences in response are based on the antisurge damper mapping, which defines how much filtering there is on the pedal.
There is nothing adaptive at all about it.

It seems I misunderstood the functionality. I have throttle filtering disabled on SportPlus, but enabled in Sport (your competitor's, Redshift, terminology). Sport, with filtering on, has a more aggressive throttle response than SportPlug (unfiltered) - i.e. I get more torque earlier in the throttle position in Sport. I was told the filtering is variable, i.e. learning. Is it fixed, and why would filtered seem more aggressive?

 

[Rusty Griswald]

Gas/ petrol tuning is way LESS $

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