Taycan production slowdown

[achaudh]

I think it's important to keep selection bias in mind. It's relatively rare for people to bother telling other people about things that they think are OK. Usually if somebody wants to express an opinion about a product, it's going to be because their opinion is pretty strongly held.

To put it in modern terms, virtually nobody bothers to write 3-star reviews.

Completely agree. People typically like to post bad experiences to vent but not necessarily positive reviews when things are going well. Human nature I guess.

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[Singularity]

Not sure if that applies to taycan tho`. It's probably the car with most recalls. I personally have seen plenty people on this forum swearing to not buy porsche ev again.
And just in case people bring up tesla... tesla's recalls are Over The Air Updates... taycan's recalls are 3weeks - 6 months in the service shop recalls

This is just complete BS. I have a Taycan since 2020 with 37k kms and the longest it has been in the shop at any one time is 2 days. All other times it has been a day or less. Pretty sure it has been in the shop at most a week *total* and half of that has been during my biannual tire changes which I do at Porsche.

My car hasn't had a single critical recall which would require an immediate service visit. They have all been such that I can continue to drive the car and am simply recommended to schedule the repair asap. Often they have done many repairs and updates during the same visit - and half the time while also changing my tires. It has been very convenient.

Yes, I'm fully aware that not all Taycan owners have had this type of experience. There have been issues. But based on any stats I've seen, the majority of owners have only had minor issues, just like me. The ones with issues are understandably quite loud and visible in the forums as they vent their frustration. I see this in every car forum regardless of brand.

The Taycan battery issues I believe will certainly get better in time as the batteries become more reliable and most importantly there are more qualified technicians available so the fixes are faster.

 

[chun]

This is just complete BS. I have a Taycan since 2020 with 37k kms and the longest it has been in the shop at any one time is 2 days. All other times it has been a day or less. Pretty sure it has been in the shop at most a week *total* and half of that has been during my biannual tire changes which I do at Porsche.

My car hasn't had a single critical recall which would require an immediate service visit. They have all been such that I can continue to drive the car and am simply recommended to schedule the repair asap. Often they have done many repairs and updates during the same visit - and half the time while also changing my tires. It has been very convenient.

Yes, I'm fully aware that not all Taycan owners have had this type of experience. There have been issues. But based on any stats I've seen, the majority of owners have only had minor issues, just like me. The ones with issues are understandably quite loud and visible in the forums as they vent their frustration. I see this in every car forum regardless of brand.

The Taycan battery issues I believe will certainly get better in time as the batteries become more reliable and most importantly there are more qualified technicians available so the fixes are faster.

Taycan by most insurance companies is quoted as the car with most in-service recalls since 2020 This is facts, not bullshit.

Taycan is also one of the most expensive cars to insure, due to the amount of issues. Also facts, not bs.

But sure, your anecdotal experience is valuable. Meanwhile first result on google for "taycan":
https://www.roadandtrack.com/news/a61320871/porsche-taycan-recall-leaky-brakes/

Currently there are over 20 in-service recalls active on a number of roughly 90.000 taycans, from brakes to batteries to heaters and more.

https://www.whatcar.com/news/reliability-survey-most-reliable-electric-cars/n26158
Taycan has been rated the least reliable call in the latest survey with 21,732 participants.

I myself currently on my taycan turbo have 2 in-service recalls scheduled for which I am waiting for parts for 3+ months: ara4 (possible faulty battery modules with risk of fire) and the new brake tube leaking. The quote from porsche is 4 weeks in service for ara4 once parts arrive, assuming my car doesn't burn down until then; and 2 days for the brake tube - but we can excuse it, porsche has never done brakes until taycan, how could have they known?

And hopefully they don't find any scratch on the bottom of my car deeper than 3mm, because aparently that results in 11.000 euros for a sheet of metal to be changed out of your pocket. Truly, great.
Oh, yea, and maybe they release the software from the facelift to the old taycans. How will this get updated? By taking your car to the service for 1-2 days Truly a miracle of technology worth 232.000 chf and 3700 chf yearly insurance, 1500 yearly warranty, 300+ for online services. Great...

One truly wonders why people don't hurry to buy 2-3 of them each, these cars are so great

 

[violuma]

One truly wonders why people don't hurry to buy 2-3 of them each, these cars are so great

I confess I'm wondering why you haven't chosen to unload yours yet, given the opinions that you have formed about them.

 

[chun]

I confess I'm wondering why you haven't chosen to unload yours yet, given the opinions that you have formed about them.

Just because i drive one doesn't mean i can't critique it. I find it more weird how people on this forum are such big fanboys and excuse such big issues from a car maker with history and experience in a quarter million euro car

Buying a quarter million porsche, you don't expect quality software. Sure. But you do expect brakes that don't fail, heaters that don't fail, batteries that don't fail (how are the other manufacturers not having these issues?).

One would also expect that they would design the battery shield to have a tolerance higher than 3mm, since it's a massive sheet of iron, but i guess the engineering team didn't have budget for that, after all it's not a 500.000 911...

And again, when people google taycan, what shows up? Most people will google it before buying it. That surely reflects to some degree in sales numbers

 

[BigBob]

I confess I'm wondering why you haven't chosen to unload yours yet, given the opinions that you have formed about them.

Maybe he would, but can't face (or afford) realising the depreciation hit? Or can't sell it because of all the recalls outstanding?

I'd accept that Chun's view is quite 'cup half empty' though.

 

[violuma]

Just because i drive one doesn't mean i can't critique it.

I never said otherwise. You're perfectly entitled to your opinion, and as far as I'm concerned, you're perfectly entitled to express it here (not that what I think about that matters one iota here).

If I were in your position, I would have offloaded it long ago and would presumably be talking to a different set of people about different things today. Since you haven't done that, my mind begins churning with potential explanations for why that is. The first one that comes to mind is that you derive enjoyment from provoking emotional reactions from strangers on the internet, but I'm sure there are plenty of other reasonable possibilities.

 

[Hirschaj]

Maybe he would, but can't face (or afford) realising the depreciation hit? Or can't sell it because of all the recalls outstanding?

I'd accept that Chun's view is quite 'cup half empty' though.

That's putting it mildly. I'd say Chun sounds much more like those Chinese and Russian actors on Quora who bash everything about everywhere else. Their arguments are always rooted in reality to a point but then they cherry pick and distort as much as possible.

I'll just keep enjoying my Taycan until it spontaneously stops working, catches fire, and fails to stop before hitting the car in front of me.

BTW... Porsche has a lot to fix going forward to remain competitive, but Chun's overzealous support for his beloved China is a major turn off. Because we all know China is perfect.

 

[chun]

but I'm sure there are plenty of other reasonable possibilities.

Such as me owning a handful of porsche, yes. A resonable posibility
The reason I don't drop it is because i love the instant torque, and it is my only 4 door car.

BTW... Porsche has a lot to fix going forward to remain competitive, but Chun's overzealous support for his beloved China is a major turn off. Because we all know China is perfect.

Far from it. I'm European, owned only Porsche cars. I have drive tested plenty other cars, including chinese ones. Doubt most people here have. The difference is not as big as you guys make it out to be, and it's definitely at a cheaper price.
At the end of the day, if a chinese car would have all the issues taycan has, it would be crucified on the internet. But Porsche lately seems to be treated like a "investment cult" where they can do no wrong. It is a car, with many issues, that should not exist at that price point

 

[Mr.Smith]

All EVs are purely a solution to regulations. No OEM wants to make an EV because of cost of batteries which can't scale to reduce cost the way people think.
OEMs are interested in headlines so investors & the BOD can think they can achieve Teslas fake valuation. Look at how GM uses thier EV growth as a headline?

Porsche is the best positioned because their buyers will pay a huge premium for the brand, throw a bunch of money at very high margin options, and R&D can be offset with the rest of VAG.

As for Taycan being a lemon?
First 2 years of any new EV platform will have a very high probability of being a lemon. So if you have MY2020 or even 2021, expect it to be a lemon. It's still the best EV, period.

FYI China is Porsche biggest market.
Chinas EV market replaced their Ponzi real estate market that is dead. Their EV manufacturers, battery companies are all sponsored and subsidized by the Chinese government. No way any other country can compete with that.
Chinese cars are very well built because of their higher use of robotics and less dependences on humans. This can not happen with a German car company because of the unions.
.

Hyundai Group has the best EV strategy IMO. 3 brands and they kick out new models, one after the other. There is a limited pool of EV buyers, but they have something for everyone. Once you're over the ioniq5, here comes the ioniq9, then the Ioniq10 etc.
Porsche is doing this now. Taycan was sizzling hot, they exhausted their pool of buyers, now Mecan EV is the golden ticket, then it will be 718, then Cayenne.

Porsche can just keep making limited edition cars every month to print money so it can fund their EVs. I'm fine with that.

 

[Hirschaj]

Far from it. I'm European

You seem to think I said you were Chinese. I did not. Feel free to reread my statement. We have plenty of citizens of the US who are in love with other countries. I could make a similar statement about them. My point was that you sound like an overzealous fan and it’s diluting your message.

 

[whitex]

The repair costs are just insane… sadly I am not sure that is just Taycan. Even ICE cars body work, and mechanical work also feels insanely expensive lately.

That is true across the board. My son's Corolla had a dent in the metal roof recently, over $3K to replace the metal roof panel (insurance approved shop). Pales in comparison to $16K Taycan glass roof replacement, but still.

As a side note, Porsche is not making things cheaper with their software. I watched a Porsche service tech use Porsche's latest online software and have to tell you the thing is extremely slow - I mean you could have a coffee between some of the clicks, and I did notice the tech gave up waiting sometimes and just started over (I'm guessing from experience he knew that the software hung?). I don't think Porsche has done the math here - this is all billable time to them if this is warranty work, but more importantly it reduces the throughput of how many cars can be serviced at a location. This is software biting Porsche yet again, this time on the service side. Not to mention that had they done OTA properly, they could have done a bunch of recalls for free instead of paying dealers to reprogram the cars. Porsche needs to build up their software skills asap.

 

[whitex]

The Taycan has had more recalls than any premium brand EV.

I don’t think you are correct there. Other brands have had many, many more recalls. The difference is the other guys do most of their recalls remotely via OTA, happens while you sleep at night (or whenever you schedule it to happen). I spent a decade driving Teslas, remember so many times seeing a headline along the line of “Tesla recalls all cars”, even got a few NHTSA notifications, usually after Tesla already “performed the recall” while my cars were parked in my garage overnight. New tech will require tweaking, but if you make of software defined and have proper OTA, it’s not a huge problem.

 

[snstevens]

https://www.fastcompany.com/91140449/here-2024s-growing-list-u-s-layoffs-by-sector

World wide, many people that would be in the target demographic for an EV with the price of a Taycan lost their jobs. It's facts. In the IT, gaming, pharma, automakers, electronics industries, this year has been marked by big layoffs.

Let’s be real here.

The article you reference calls out a maximum of 6-10 thousand layoffs (world wide)for the remainder of the year across dozens of companies. This is hardly a massive layoff across high-tech industries. In fact, it’s much smaller than it was several years ago at the end of the pandemic. On top of that, most of these people will be easily rehired in the area of their skill. The total unemployment rate in the United States is currently 4.1% and over 200,000 new jobs were created last month alone.

What is this even supposed to mean? Do you own a company by the name Fisker?
Yes, reviews mean a lot, especially from big personalities Other car brands learned it. Your feelings on this don't really matter; MOST people look at reviews for the products they buy.

What you’re saying is that you take impulsive decisions, i guess... good for you. Other people do research, especially before spending 250.000 on a car.

Please stop with these Incredibly insulting comments OK? On this forum, we try to respect the opinions of others and try not to needlessly insult them.

It is clear that you view it as your job is to throw shade at Porsche and from the responses you’re getting it appears nobody is buying it.

It you want to be a shill for the Chinese EV manufacturers that is of course up to you, but it isn’t going to get you very far on this forum.

 

[D00notD00d]

Slowdowns in EV production will affect battery producers, many of whom have had government subsidies.
What happens to supply & support if EV sales falter and your battery manufacturer goes bust?
An example here (note Taycan batteries are manufactured by LG, not this company, which supplies Ford and VW).

A leading South Korean producer of electric vehicle batteries has declared itself in crisis as its customers struggle with disappointing EV sales in Europe and the US.
‘SK On, the world’s fourth-largest EV battery maker behind Chinese giants CATL and BYD and South Korean rival LG Energy Solution, has recorded losses for 10 consecutive quarters since being spun off by its parent company in 2021. Its net debt has increased more than fivefold, from Won2.9tn ($2.1bn) to Won15.6tn over the same period, as western EV sales have fallen far short of its expectations.

With losses snowballing, chief executive Lee Seok-hee announced a series of cost-cutting and working practice measures last Monday, describing them as a state of “emergency management”.

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