Taycan to Switzerland & Austria

[Gru]

Gotthard pass ..... I once broke a turbo near the summit on a Saturday evening

Great trip reports ! I used to go to Zermatt every winter (before COVID): Coeur des Alpes was our favorite hotel there

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[tigerbalm]

Day 9: Mountain passes near Zell-am-See (Austria)

Today marks the half-way point of this road-trip and is a kind-of rest day for us. We decide – as it's only 20 minutes away – to spend it at the Grossglockner Hochalpenstrasse.

We've been there many times – but as part of the purpose of this trip is to experience the Turbo S difference – it will still be different!

We start the day with the longest range we've ever seen reported by our car on 21" summer tyres.

And head through forested sections up to the start of the road.

Where we pay a reduced toll of €32 due to having an electric vehicle.

We knew – as it is a Sunday and another sunny day – that it would be busy. However, it was so busy – the bikers were causing traffic jams – and struggled to find parking spots themselves!

Still it is a very enjoyable set of roads to drive.

And if you time things right – you can still find quiet moments – where the twists and turns open out in front of you.

Despite the traffic – we think today is the day we experienced the Turbo S difference over our 4S.

The ability for the car to drop anchor and slow down coming into a sharp corner, the sheer explosive acceleration on exiting, kept flat by PDCC in-between. Even the electric sport sound added to the experience here – never knew it has a kind of "rev matching blip" in Sport Plus mode when under hard deceleration!

We could comfortably keep up with bikers pushing it – and plenty were!

Passing a rare 911 Sports Classic.

Plugging in for a free charge while eating some ice-cream! We don't need to – plenty of range today – but one of our rules on road-trips is to take on power when we're stopped – especially if its complementary.

Its been a week now since we've paid for any energy – which is really amazing – all these adventures since Baden-Baden – and the entire Switzerland portion has been powered by gifted electricity.



We drive up to the glacier at the top – which seems to be getting smaller each time we're here.



As we're stopping here for lunch – we plug in – at 2350 meters – for what we think is our highest ever charge. Power is supplied at reasonable 11 kW.



Plenty of Porsche's today – with Shark Blue looking the most popular – at least among the modern 911s.

As it's getting to the afternoon – and we've spent about five hours here – we start our descent back down to Zell-am-See.

We appreciated our carbon ceramic braking system on the long way down – seeing many signs asking: "check your brakes" – and being behind a Hungarian Ford Transit fan suffering badly from brake fade – with their hazards on and the smell of fire ?.

Passing Porsche Design as we turn into our hotel.

And plug back in for a free top-up.



The days charging stats

Location	Start SOC %	End SOC %	kWh added	Cost	Duration	Ambient Temp	Battery Temp	Charger Type	Network
Grossglockner 1	66%	69%	2.5	€0.00	20 mins	28	33	AC 7 kW	Free
Grossglockner 2	66%	85%	15.9	€0.00	1 hour 30 miins	24	35	AC 11 kW	Free
Elements Resort Zell-am-See	66%	100%	28.5	€0.00	3 hours	25	33	AC 7 kW	Free

Today we did 160 km over 4:28 hours, with an average speed of 37 km/h, consuming 27.6 kWh/100km.

 

[Porsche-Guru]

We appreciated our carbon ceramic braking system on the long way down – seeing many signs asking: "check your brakes" – and being behind a Hungarian Ford Transit fan suffering badly from brake fade – with their hazards on and the smell of fire ?.

Ah... just the question I wanted to ask?

On ICE cars, one always uses the engine breaking (shift to lower gears) while going downhill ... although there is a still a limit to how much braking this provides -i.e. the engine rev limit is still the inhibiting factor and at some point, actual brakes will likely still be needed (depending on slope/ speed).

1) How does one manage this in an electric car?
Does the Regen braking automatically kick in when using the brakes (i.e. provide the engine breaking effect automatically)? How does the car judge the amount of regen braking vs actual discs.
On a ICE car. one controls this using a combination of shifting a gear down and manual braking. How does one do this in a electric?


2) What would setting the speed limiter do? Does that ensure that the Taycan never exceeds the speed by using as much regen braking as needed (and forces the car to the speed limit) or does the car still exceed the limiter speed and additional manual braking is needed?
Much like an ICE automatic car, even if you set the limiter - at some point (depending on slope/speed), manual disc braking may still be needed.

I am curious... I have driven ICE cars in high altitude slopes (Europe and Indian Himalayas) and never an issue - but can't get my head around electric...

 

[ciaranob]

Day 9: Mountain passes near Zell-am-See (Austria)

Today marks the half-way point of this road-trip and is a kind-of rest day for us. We decide – as it's only 20 minutes away – to spend it at the Grossglockner Hochalpenstrasse.

We've been there many times – but as part of the purpose of this trip is to experience the Turbo S difference – it will still be different!

We start the day with the longest range we've ever seen reported by our car on 21" summer tyres.

Just for ref I routinely get ca 270 miles (ca 435 km) in summer temps on 21” tires with AC off but in my first year got a few ‘guesstimates’ as high as 290 miles (ca 466 km) again with AC off.

With my SoH dropping to 88% this year I’m not attaining those higher numbers but still getting low 270s which is still great.

Clearly somewhat different terrain so impressive still.

 

[Gru]

Ah... just the question I wanted to ask?

On ICE cars, one always uses the engine breaking (shift to lower gears) while going downhill ... although there is a still a limit to how much braking this provides -i.e. the engine rev limit is still the inhibiting factor and at some point, actual brakes will likely still be needed (depending on slope/ speed).

1) How does one manage this in an electric car?
Does the Regen braking automatically kick in when using the brakes (i.e. provide the engine breaking effect automatically)? How does the car judge the amount of regen braking vs actual discs.
On a ICE car. one controls this using a combination of shifting a gear down and manual braking. How does one do this in a electric?


2) What would setting the speed limiter do? Does that ensure that the Taycan never exceeds the speed by using as much regen braking as needed (and forces the car to the speed limit) or does the car still exceed the limiter speed and additional manual braking is needed?
Much like an ICE automatic car, even if you set the limiter - at some point (depending on slope/speed), manual disc braking may still be needed.

I am curious... I have driven ICE cars in high altitude slopes (Europe and Indian Himalayas) and never an issue - but can't get my head around electric...

I've been down (and up) on a few steep roads: I never felt that brakes were fading. But I have to add I was never alone and couldn't really drive it like I stole it ...

ACC/Speed limiter will use regen to stick to the limit . I don't think of a steep enough road that would require manual disc braking to maintain the speed. That would be needed only if you drive it and want to slow down from 140 to 40 kmh/mph (for instance) on a short distance

 

[Gru]

one could do the math, taking into account the mass, deceleration and the max. regen possible...

 

[Mats]

Day 3: Baden-Baden (Germany) -> Interlaken (Switzerland)

We awoke to a beautiful morning in Baden-Baden – with blue skies and an already rising temperature.



Arriving last night we had 47% charge and the plan was to drive the short distance outside of town to the local Porsche Centre to use their 300 kW Porsche Design chargers. We had charged there when driving through in 2021 – so it seemed like a good idea. It was also the last non-IONITY charge we had built into our plan for this road-trip.

When we arrived, the charging screen showed two options: (a) use a RFID charging card or (b) use Plug & Charge to initiate service. We had been wondering if these chargers supported Plug & Charge – so of course that was the choice we made – plugging it straight into our car.

That's when trouble hit: Authorisation Failure. Ah well, maybe it isn't configured correctly, we restarted this time using our Porsche Charging Service card. Same outcome – auth failure. A third attempt did not produce any different outcome.

We rang our local (its UK based) Porsche Charging Service support number, explined the situation and they were able to confirm that these chargers are no longer part of the Porsche Charging Service and are only available to users who have been approved by the local dealers "database".

Bummer! Had not anticipated this and because we charged here before with no issue – it didn't even cross our mind during planning to verify. Fail to plan, plan to fail.

Though we do have to say, that it really feels like the entire Porsche Charging Network at dealers is a mess, very confusing – becoming unreliable – and the rules are very unclear for users. We do have to acknowledge that the chargers here had been taken off the PCM list – we just failed to check.

It remains a lost opportunity to have built a nice private charging network for Porsche EV owners and the lovely Porsche Lounge we were at yesterday will not be enought to keep the fleet on the road!

There was no obviously brilliant alternative – so we chose a 150 kW EnBW that was just off the autobahn outside the town – which we knew for sure would accept our Porsche Charging Service RFID card.

When we arrived – there was already one car plugged into side A of the 150 kW charger and side B was broken. Either way, guessing that plugging two cars in would have turned each charger into 75 kW – which wouldn't be brilliant.

There was a banged-up looking 50 kW unit idle – so we plugged into that – under the philosophy that taking in power is always good – while we figured out a new plan.

We found a set of 300 kW Aral/BP chargers along our planned route in the Black Forest that looked good and would start with the Porsche Charging Service card – so we plotted that in, unplugged from the frankly glacial 50 kW charger and set off. Despite the branding on the side there was nothing quick about it!

We soon picked up the B500 road through the Black Forest – and its race track like curves and crash barriers.

We attach our Go Pro to the car to capture some of the driving experiences at 4K – pulling in over 100 Gb of footage over the next hour or so. Enjoying the endless kilometres of forest.

Reaching our new planned charging stop in the early afternoon with a 29C sun high in the sky. The charger quickly started with our RFID card and started delivering 265 kW of energy.

Has there ever been a charging station painted to match the Neptune Blue of our car so well?





It wasn't long until our "tank" had reached 85% and we continued on our scenic route – with our co-driver enjoying the 3D views of the landscape from the passenger display!

Later, we avail of a comfort break – we pulled onto a random service station that was attached to a nearby autobahn – and spotted a bank of idle IONITY chargers. This wasn't expected!

Time for a bit of on-the-spot replanning – we'd grab a full charge here – while eating some currywurst – that would allow us to cut out a planned IONITY stop near Bern – and we'd arrive at our hotel tonight and grab a destination charge there.

The outside air temps was 32C at this stage and we had just done a short but fast autobahn run to reach the service station – when we stepped outside to plug in the car – could not believe how loud the cooling fans were running. We've heard the fans spin up before – but never like this! In fact, plugging into the charger caused them to spin down a little.

They make an impressive sound – drawing air across the radiators to cool down the battery – that was now hitting 60C.

Altogether, a rather messy charging day – due to Porsche Centre Baden-Baden – but one that didn't disrupt our plans too much.



After our pit stop and refuelling both our car and our bodies, it was back to the B500 forest road.

Before eventually reaching the German/Swiss border at Waldshut-Tiengan. There were long queues going the other way – entering Germany – but the Swiss side was idle and we drove straight through without being stopped.

Joining the motorway network towards Interlaken – our destination for tonight.

Picking up the lake to our left as we got closer to the town.

Eventually arriving at our hotel for tonight – The Victoria–Jungfrau Grand Hotel – where we had the valet plug in our car for a 22 kW AC overnight charge.



And headed out to grab some late night food – after a freshen up and download of footage from our various cameras.

The days charging stats

Location	Start SOC %	End SOC %	kWh added	Cost	Duration	Ambient Temp	Battery Temp	Charger Type	Network
EnBW Rasthofweg	44%	62%	22.17	€15.65	28 mins	27	31	DC 50 kW	Porsche Charging Service
Arel Sulz am Neckar	28%	85%	48.0	€22.10	22 mins	29	47	DC 300 kW	Porsche Charging Service
IONITY Neckarburg West	69%	100%	25.5	€8.41	30 mins	31	51	DC 350 kW	Porsche Charging Service
Victoria–Jungfrau Grand Hotel	25%	100%	62.8	€20.96	3 hours 25 mins	27	33	AC 22 kW	Destination Charging

Today we did 454 km over 8:11 hours, with an average speed of 88 km/h, consuming 22.6 kWh/100km.

Good to know about the Porsche charging in Baden-Baden as that was in our plans as backup before leaving for our Swiss roadtrip. We are leaving this Saturday morning getting the 4 hr ferry Trelleborg-Rostock followed by a short 3 hr ride to some friends north of Hanover. Next destination b4 Baden-Baden will be Clervaux in Luxemburg to tick off the photo exhibition The family of man from our bucket list.

 

[PorscheCH]

Gotthard pass ..... I once broke a turbo near the summit on a Saturday evening

Not sure what @tigerbalm did around the Gotthard but the tunnel is now indefinitely closed due to a 20 mt long crack. So all is left is this nice pass road. Maybe the vibrations of exhaust pipes of the Taycan Turbo s?

 

[tigerbalm]

Not sure what @tigerbalm did around the Gotthard but the tunnel is now indefinitely closed due to a 20 mt long crack. So all is left is this nice pass road.

OMG! That pass is going to be hell with traffic volumes and trucks. Hope they get it re-opened before snowfall.

Maybe the vibrations of exhaust pipes of the Taycan Turbo s?

The roar from the electric sports sound option!

 

[tigerbalm]

Ah... just the question I wanted to ask?

On ICE cars, one always uses the engine breaking (shift to lower gears) while going downhill ... although there is a still a limit to how much braking this provides -i.e. the engine rev limit is still the inhibiting factor and at some point, actual brakes will likely still be needed (depending on slope/ speed).

1) How does one manage this in an electric car?
Does the Regen braking automatically kick in when using the brakes (i.e. provide the engine breaking effect automatically)? How does the car judge the amount of regen braking vs actual discs.
On a ICE car. one controls this using a combination of shifting a gear down and manual braking. How does one do this in a electric?


2) What would setting the speed limiter do? Does that ensure that the Taycan never exceeds the speed by using as much regen braking as needed (and forces the car to the speed limit) or does the car still exceed the limiter speed and additional manual braking is needed?
Much like an ICE automatic car, even if you set the limiter - at some point (depending on slope/speed), manual disc braking may still be needed.

I am curious... I have driven ICE cars in high altitude slopes (Europe and Indian Himalayas) and never an issue - but can't get my head around electric...

We were in Sports or Sports Plus mode – which puts on more aggressive re-gen by default – though it's easily controlled by the dedicated button on the steering wheel.

That gives you a base re-gen level while "free wheeling" downhill – which feels like engine braking of being in one gear (and no more) lower than you ordinarily would be in.

However, on coming up on a sharp hairpin bend or a slower moving vehicle in front – you'll need to apply some pressure to the brake pedal – which will (depending on speed) – enable more re-gen or automatically blend in the physical brakes as required.

On average we find we add 1% to our batter for every 500 meters of altitude we descend – though that depends on speed and steepness of the decline. However – it's proving to be a good rule-of-thumb on this trip.

In the later afternoon – when the roads had quietened significantly – we were heading down the 12% slope's between 80-100 km/h – and it's at those speeds that the physical brakes do a lot more work – especially over 10 km of sharp descents.

We feel we've giving our carbon ceramic's a good workout on this trip between the alps and the autobahn – but they are by no means necessary – and we consider them to be a (much loved) cosmetic item as much as anything.

ACC would keep you back from the car in front – and would use both re-gen and physical braking as required. However, on the very steep hairpin bends – you risk having the radar lose sight of the vehicle in front – and might increase speed right at the apex of a turn – when you least want it to. It would all depend on the target speed you have set for it.

In our case – we definitely want – and did – manually drive the car in the alpine environment. That initial acceleration from the Turbo S is just so much fun.

 

[Porsche-Guru]

We were in Sports or Sports Plus mode – which puts on more aggressive re-gen by default – though it's easily controlled by the dedicated button on the steering wheel.

That gives you a base re-gen level while "free wheeling" downhill – which feels like engine braking of being in one gear (and no more) lower than you ordinarily would be in.

However, on coming up on a sharp hairpin bend or a slower moving vehicle in front – you'll need to apply some pressure to the brake pedal – which will (depending on speed) – enable more re-gen or automatically blend in the physical brakes as required.

On average we find we add 1% to our batter for every 500 meters of altitude we descend – though that depends on speed and steepness of the decline. However – it's proving to be a good rule-of-thumb on this trip.

In the later afternoon – when the roads had quietened significantly – we were heading down the 12% slope's between 80-100 km/h – and it's at those speeds that the physical brakes do a lot more work – especially over 10 km of sharp descents.

We feel we've giving our carbon ceramic's a good workout on this trip between the alps and the autobahn – but they are by no means necessary – and we consider them to be a (much loved) cosmetic item as much as anything.

ACC would keep you back from the car in front – and would use both re-gen and physical braking as required. However, on the very steep hairpin bends – you risk having the radar lose sight of the vehicle in front – and might increase speed right at the apex of a turn – when you least want it to. It would all depend on the target speed you have set for it.

In our case – we definitely want – and did – manually drive the car in the alpine environment. That initial acceleration from the Turbo S is just so much fun.

Thanks....
I guess the only difference in ICE manual and electric is that with an ICE, one can control the descent by down-shifting (multiple times); while in an electric there is no such (manual) mechanism.
The regen will brake as best as it can and then disc brakes will kick in.

The more I think about it, it starts to make sense...

On a electric car:
Going downhill... Regen baking will control descent and always be prioritised automatically, and the physical discs will kick in only when needed.

On a manual ICE car:
Going downhill... I would try and control descent using gears and then eventually use the brakes when needed.

I guess, in electrics... the car does everything itself.
---------------
The key difference is that in ICE, one would normally use gears to slow down and then use the brake, when needed.
In the Taycan, just use the brakes... and the car will (intelligently) figure out how much to use Regen and when to kick in physical discs.

I think, I am getting it as I am writing it...

 

[tigerbalm]

I think, I am getting it as I am writing it...

With an EV: riding the brake is good – on a ICE: it's bad!

With an EV: frequent up and downhill is good for energy usage – on a ICE: it's bad!

With an EV: a smooth flat motorway with constant energy draw is the hardest situation – in a ICE: it's usually the most efficient.

A lot of stuff with EV's are "bit flips" on what makes sense with ICE.

 

[anonymouse]

Next destination b4 Baden-Baden will be Clervaux in Luxemburg to tick off the photo exhibition The family of man from our bucket list.

That looks amazing - do tell us what it was like.
Your post sent me to the plans for my own upcoming road trip down to the Black Forest, to see if I could squeeze Clervaux in -- but sadly we have a concert in Köln and a ballet in Baden-Baden with not enough time in between to pop over to Luxembourg. Next trip! (At least by taking the direct route we will be able to visit that shiny new Porsche Charging Lounge ...)

 

[anonymouse]

Incidentally for those of you heading for the Black Forest for some windy roads, I found in the Porsche app "Roads" a driving route that looks pretty good:
https://roads.porsche.com/content/en/routes/black-forest-and-rhine-valley

I think it's one of the routes that Porsche Experience takes people on, starting in Baden-Baden. I'm going to try (most of) it in October - then on to visit the Taycan Factory in Stuttgart.

 

[ciaranob]

911 Dakar
What an interesting car the 911 Dakar is. Never thought we'd see one "in the flesh". And with the crazy expensive sticker pack too!

Forgot to share these - TWO Dakar 911's at my dealership in Houston one with that pricey livery, along with other eye candy:

And that GT3 Touring over $300K with NO factory warranty!! If you have it no need to ask

Definitely had an 'outdoor' vibe on this visit

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