45K? How low can it go (depreciation)?

[Fish Fingers]

If they do put petrol up 10p litre (done deal some say) it will be intersting.

https://moneyweek.com/personal-finance/tax/will-fuel-duty-rise-in-october-budget

I expect it will fire up the anti EV brigade even further.....but surely it will help firm up used ev prices. The people who can't afford new, may start comparing a used ev to Ice and associated running costs.

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[Donar]

In The Netherlands, Porsche dictates maintenance cost -> https://www.porsche.com/netherlands/nl/service/maintenance/prices/taycan/

I know. And I have service contract for another years. Was more talking about non regular broken things. Although I do have warranty till 2028 ?

 

[whitex]

I heard they are now giving them away with 911 purchases

I have heard unconfirmed rumors that some dealers "forced" some customers to buy a couple of Taycans before they'd let them have some rare allocation for a 911.

 

[Scandinavian]

I have heard unconfirmed rumors that some dealers "forced" some customers to buy a couple of Taycans before they'd let them have some rare allocation for a 911.

That is the situation for trying to buy a 911 GT3RS, yes. But normal 911 cars are not hard to buy.

 

[whitex]

Bought my Taycan a year ago. If I now search same spec it’s 15% cheaper. Market prices definitely dropped here in NL.

What year is your Taycan? It's an ST so 2022 or later? Do you really consider an annual 15% retail price depreciation an unusual drop for a sig digit priced sedan? What would you consider normal depreciation between for the first 4 years of a sig digit prices sedan in your home area?

 

[n3ophyte]

I would argue that UK EV purchase tax incentives (low benefit in kind % and 100% capital expense write down) DO filter down to 2nd hand purchasers as a result of Taycan depreciation.

I wouldn’t have bought this Turbo S new at £179,000 (£171,474 + £7,500 PTS due to Carrara White being no longer available) but was a buyer at £89,000 second hand.

 

[whitex]

Isn't it interesting how this Youtuber gives an example below of a black base $45K Taycan, but does not say how much the acid green car they actually drove is selling for today? Apparently (at least he claims so at 3:33) that PORSCHE logo on the back lights up, so it's a modded car with parts from 2025. He even claims (at 6:01) that his acid green Taycan only weight 4.5 hundred pounds (450lb) - now that's a mod I'd like to get!

 

[Donar]

What year is your Taycan? It's an ST to 2022 or later? Do you really consider an annual 15% retail price depreciation an unusual drop for a sig digit priced sedan? What would you consider normal depreciation between for the first 4 years of a sig digit prices sedan in your home area?

No I don’t. What I meant is I compared my 2022 ST RWD <1 year old, <10,000km with todays market 2023 ST RWD <1 year old, <10,000km.

I find roughly similar specced for 10-15% less than I paid a year ago.

If I would buy similar car I have (2022, ~30,000kms) today it’s about 25% less of what I paid last year. And that is asking price at dealership. So when I want to sell it myself I would take a 30% hit in the second year and my car is worth about half the price of original retail price of €133K.

 

[whitex]

That is the situation for trying to buy a 911 GT3RS, yes. But normal 911 cars are not hard to buy.

That is why I said "rare allocation". Not all allocations are rare today - they were during the pandemic.

 

[whitex]

No I don’t. What I meant is I compared my 2022 ST RWD <1 year old, <10,000km with todays market 2023 ST RWD <1 year old, <10,000km.

I find roughly similar specced for 10-15% less than I paid a year ago.

Ah, thanks for clarifying. I did not get that you were comparing same age at the time of purchase car as opposed to same model year.

The used car values have been correcting since the pandemic crazyness. 2-3 years ago you could have sold a one year old Taycan above MSRP. A year ago, it fell under MSRP, now they are following standard high end depreciation in a slowing economy. For EV's there are additional factors involving government incentives (past and present) affecting values, but that is region specific.

If I would buy similar car I have (2022, ~30,000kms) today it’s about 25% less of what I paid last year. And that is asking price at dealership. So when I want to sell it myself I would take a 30% hit in the second year and my car is worth about half the price of original retail price of €133K.

Comparing retail (dealer) price to trade-in or private sale will always show you a loss (with some very, very few exceptions). If you buy a car at MSRP, and that car costed the dealer 85% of what you paid, so unless the dealer cannot get another one from the factory for some reason, there is no way they'd give you more than 85% of your purchase price as a trade-in, that's 15% depreciation in 15 seconds after you drive off the lot (probably more if the car was hard to sell)!

 

[Redhot2474]

I have heard unconfirmed rumors that some dealers "forced" some customers to buy a couple of Taycans before they'd let them have some rare allocation for a 911.

Absolutely true

 

[Jonathan S.]

"Most of us are business owners who bought a Taycan with tax benefits or are private owners with a tax benefit. When selling that benefit is gone and someone has to pay full price. That full price is absurd hence the depreciation."

Which means the claimed "depreciation" is just a variation on Man Maths hence the actual diminution in value is far less if correctly calculated with a denominator that reflects the tax-adjusted price to the original purchaser.


"Isn't it interesting how this Youtuber gives an example below of a black base $45K Taycan, but does not say how much the acid green car they actually drove is selling for today?"

That guy also assesses the cargo capacity by citing only the official spec and referencing the items in the trunk that appear to be so trivial as to be capable of being carried in a passenger's lap and footwell.

 

[whitex]

Which means the claimed "depreciation" is just a variation on Man Maths hence the actual diminution in value is far less if correctly calculated with a denominator that reflects the tax-adjusted price to the original purchaser.

In other words, government EV incentives lower the original (new) car price, which act as an instant, artificial depreciation, on top of which regular depreciation builds. An extreme example to illustrate. Imagine if government offered 50% off MSRP incentive on all Taycans. Now, someone sells a 1 year old Taycan for 40% of MSRP, what is the depreciation? By traditional metrics, it's a 60% depreciation, but in reality, it's only 20% to the person who bought the original Taycan at half price.

As a side note, apparently our own US government is not realizing this either. By tying EV incentives to politically motivated qualifications criteria which leave out the top ~20% of income earners from the incentives, they are actually creating monetary incentives for people that spend the most money on new cars to buy non-EV vehicles, because they have to eat the artificial instant depreciation created by the politically tied up incentive (I am sure if they could, they'd tie it to who you voted for too, I know Biden tried to tie it to EV's produced by UAW unionized plants, UAW being a big political donor for him). Why would someone buy a EV, if 80% of people (but not them) can get it for almost 20% off new (in case of Model 3)? Those 20% of people will buy ICE cars instead of EV's (ok, maybe not all of them, but most of them are the top 20% of earners because they know how to do math on their finances).

 

[ben1]

Depreciation in Europe seems to be less than in US.
And it are mostly the high-end full option cars that take a big depreciation hit.

I bought my Taycan 3 years ago for 92000 euro. Today similar cars are sold for about 62000 euro. So I lost about 10000 euro per year. Maybe 12000 euro worst case, but not much more.
In line with what I expected.

 

[Bennie]

In The Netherlands, Porsche dictates maintenance cost -> https://www.porsche.com/netherlands/nl/service/maintenance/prices/taycan/

Still interesting to compare prices. My initial dealer is more expensive (“we deliver extra service”…) than the one I bought my Macan recently.

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