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Gino

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Pardon me @Gino but this seems a bit over the top, and your worries overstated. This is a safety precaution recall, and we can all deal with it without worry that our houses will burn down.

Here is a summary of how I'm responding to this recall --
  • Charging On the Road or within 50 miles of Home - Charge to whatever SOC makes sense to me with no upper limit. Sometimes this is 90%, sometimes 95%. Generally the charge is going to be less by the time I reach home so when I park in the garage I expect it to be in the 80% ± 5% range.
  • Charging at Home - I currently limit to 80%, and since there is a dearth of news items of fires occurring in Taycans (other than the 3 mentioned above), I sleep well and don't worry about the house burning down.

To be honest, this reminds of of the time my Lexus GX 350 had a fuel pump recall, except that there was nothing I could do (like charge to a lower SOC) to reduce risk. I wish there had been, as it took several months for the replacement fuel pumps to become available, and in the meantime I crossed my fingers.

I appreciate that you might see things differently, but I hope my perspective helps.
I hope you are right & do appreciate your perspective as well as your use case.
I have worked in high tech semiconductor capital equcorporate environments with very detailed legal contracts which outline both buyer & seller liabilities for all products and services.
I was only stating the reality which Porsche/VW group faces every day concerning product liability & representations.
I am satisfied with the way Porsche has handled these issues and would have likely advised them to do exactly what they are doing to mitigate the financial impact they face until these issues are mostly behind them.
The real danger for all EVs is after their battery warranties expire. Improper repair poses the largest risk of fire going forward.
I work with the NTHSB with regards to EV battery safety and their biggest concern for all EVs after collision induced battery fires is improper battery replacement/repair by unlicensed, uncertified or DIY mechanics.
I believe as long as certified, licensed battery technicians at the dealers or shops which are authorized to repair or replace these batteries are used then the risk of fire will remain extremely low.
I was just stating the obvious position the Porsche/VW group is hedging against. They had a safety issue with battery fires early on which is safe to say they have managed well to date from what I can see.
The range issue is another thing altogether since they never said the range was 80% of 225 when it was initially sold.
Does 200 or 225 mile range matter to me? No. I have 4 vehicles I drive less than 3K miles per year.
I travel by air internationally & domestically 75% of the year where I drive rental cars more miles than my personal vehicles. All I care about is that the car is safe, I can charge as infrequently as possible to 100% and the battery will last 15+ years with at least 50 miles of range after year 10.
Unfortunately I cannot get 220 charging in my garage so I will be forced to use my 120V charging in January when my EA subscription expires.
I will not charge more than 12 hours a day as the Porsche service bulletin suggests back in early 2022 but it also states the 120V charger should only be used in emergencies to add only enough charge to get to a 220v or DC fast charger.
Even my dealer in Newport Beach, CA was unaware of this Porsche service bulletin.
I wouldn’t have purchased my Taycan if I was told I couldn’t charge daily using the 120V charger. Some said this bulletin was to protect the customer’s wiring in their garage but as an electrical engineer this makes absolutely no sense as long as you install the correct wiring & receptacle to accommodate the 120v or 220
I’m pretty confident all of my desires will be realized very comfortably.
Will I buy another Porsche EV or ICE vehicle to add to what I already own?

Yes! I would love a 2 door convertible ICE (before they discontinue the ICE version) in the next year and a long range EV SUV with 400-600 miles range in the next 3-5 years (or sooner).
Will I get rid of any vehicles?
No, not unless they get totaled in an accident.
I just need to buy another home to park the next 2 Porsche’s I purchase…
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snstevens

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I hope you are right & do appreciate your perspective as well as your use case.
I have worked in high tech semiconductor capital equcorporate environments with very detailed legal contracts which outline both buyer & seller liabilities for all products and services.
I was only stating the reality which Porsche/VW group faces every day concerning product liability & representations.
I am satisfied with the way Porsche has handled these issues and would have likely advised them to do exactly what they are doing to mitigate the financial impact they face until these issues are mostly behind them.
The real danger for all EVs is after their battery warranties expire. Improper repair poses the largest risk of fire going forward.
I work with the NTHSB with regards to EV battery safety and their biggest concern for all EVs after collision induced battery fires is improper battery replacement/repair by unlicensed, uncertified or DIY mechanics.
I believe as long as certified, licensed battery technicians at the dealers or shops which are authorized to repair or replace these batteries are used then the risk of fire will remain extremely low.
I was just stating the obvious position the Porsche/VW group is hedging against. They had a safety issue with battery fires early on which is safe to say they have managed well to date from what I can see.
The range issue is another thing altogether since they never said the range was 80% of 225 when it was initially sold.
Does 200 or 225 mile range matter to me? No. I have 4 vehicles I drive less than 3K miles per year.
I travel by air internationally & domestically 75% of the year where I drive rental cars more miles than my personal vehicles. All I care about is that the car is safe, I can charge as infrequently as possible to 100% and the battery will last 15+ years with at least 50 miles of range after year 10.
Unfortunately I cannot get 220 charging in my garage so I will be forced to use my 120V charging in January when my EA subscription expires.
I will not charge more than 12 hours a day as the Porsche service bulletin suggests back in early 2022 but it also states the 120V charger should only be used in emergencies to add only enough charge to get to a 220v or DC fast charger.
Even my dealer in Newport Beach, CA was unaware of this Porsche service bulletin.
I wouldn’t have purchased my Taycan if I was told I couldn’t charge daily using the 120V charger. Some said this bulletin was to protect the customer’s wiring in their garage but as an electrical engineer this makes absolutely no sense as long as you install the correct wiring & receptacle to accommodate the 120v or 220
I’m pretty confident all of my desires will be realized very comfortably.
Will I buy another Porsche EV or ICE vehicle to add to what I already own?

Yes! I would love a 2 door convertible ICE (before they discontinue the ICE version) in the next year and a long range EV SUV with 400-600 miles range in the next 3-5 years (or sooner).
Will I get rid of any vehicles?
No, not unless they get totaled in an accident.
I just need to buy another home to park the next 2 Porsche’s I purchase…
Not to try to sell you on something you’re not interested in, but I really think adding a 240 V circuit to your garage is a very small investment in both higher speed charging and safety.

The issue in 120V circuits isn’t voltage, it’s the amount of current you’re drawing over a very long period of time. that serves to heat the wires in a way that over a long period of time could cause a fire risk. You have no way of knowing how good a job the electricians did installing that circuit that you’ll be using, how tight the receptacle screws are, etc.

I really recommend the 240 V installation since it is relatively cheap and it allows you to have additional peace of mind.
 

whitex

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Thanks for looking this up. Interesting that there were only 3 cases and they were 3-4 years ago. I read the Wikipedia info and the Cross Turismo was a "new" car. The others were likely 2020 versions.
Worth noting that ChatGPT is not trained on the most up to date internet. Sept 2021 was the original cutoff, though apparently a bunch of data up to July 2023 has been fed to it since.
 

whitex

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I am only speculating but it looks like the OEM is using the monitoring software to determine if there is a flawed battery pack/modules. This software was originally to be installed via the workshop, but appears they are now pushing OTA.
The advice to charge max 80% and not near any structures is probably just a precaution until they obtain the data to determine the battery status. All this is not a situation or result commensurate with what these cars cost. This is a real mess.
Porsche is not pushing the software update via OTA. They are collecting some telemetry data (using old software) from which they are deducing whether or not the battery may have a problem. The service dealer also has the capability to run some remote diagnostics OTA - nowhere near the level Tesla has, where the engineer can in real-time connect to the vehicle terminal as if they were sitting in the car themselves, but things like request a VAL (Vehicle Analysis Logs) they can do.
 

whitex

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Some said this bulletin was to protect the customer’s wiring in their garage but as an electrical engineer this makes absolutely no sense as long as you install the correct wiring & receptacle to accommodate the 120v or 220
This could be a mitigation against people having less than perfect installations or simply having more devices drawing from the same circuit.

Let me give you a real life example. NEMA 14-50 socket is rated to deliver 40A sustained load. However, it is allowed by code around Canada and USA to install a NEMA 14-50 socket on a 40A circuit, which is rated to only deliver 32A sustained load, but will not trip if a 40A EVSE is connected to it, creating a non-code compliant situation. Tesla, as an EV pioneer, ran into this - there were a few fires, I remember one specifically in Toronto, due to someone plugging in Teslas 40A Mobile Connector into their NEMA 14-50 on a 40 A circuit, which probably wasn't perfect to start with, so eventually caused a fire. Tesla reacted by changing the Mobile Connector firmware to limit it to 32A for all Canadian cars, then redesigned the hardware to max out at 32A, which still is the limit for their Mobile Connector for North America. They recommend anything >32A to be hardwired, even though if as you say "as long as you install the correct wiring & receptacle" you could safely draw 40A indefinitely. I have daily for a full decade.

120V circuits tend to have many sockets on them, which makes this even worse. An EVSE will draw 12A from a 15A circuit, but statistically speaking, in an average home, there is a high likelihood something else is also using that same circuit to draw a couple of Amps, which now brings the circuit beyond its rated safe sustained current, but below value which would trip the breaker. In court, Porsche could argue that it's the homeowner's fault for plugging too many devices into a the same circuit as the car, but most juries would side with the homeowner for not being educated enough to understand this. 240V outlets in NA typically have just one socket on them, so less risk of oversubscription.

That said, I suspect Porsche's "do not charge from 120V" comes from both, the risk mitigation as per above, as well as car longevity. Charging at 120V keeps the car's electronics on a lot longer than from 240V, which means you're putting more wear on the electronics, which could translate into warranty repairs. Porsche electronics around charging seem a little fragile - e.g. my less than 2 year old 19.2kW onboard charger already died a couple of weeks ago, and it's uptime was minimal as the car has maybe 13K miles on it and most of those were charged on 19.2kW (240V/80A) so very low uptime for the onboard charger (since charging is very quick).
 
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Gino

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Not to try to sell you on something you’re not interested in, but I really think adding a 240 V circuit to your garage is a very small investment in both higher speed charging and safety.

The issue in 120V circuits isn’t voltage, it’s the amount of current you’re drawing over a very long period of time. that serves to heat the wires in a way that over a long period of time could cause a fire risk. You have no way of knowing how good a job the electricians did installing that circuit that you’ll be using, how tight the receptacle screws are, etc.

I really recommend the 240 V installation since it is relatively cheap and it allows you to have additional peace of mind.
I would love to install 220V service but my garage is on the other side of the common area driveway in my community so the cost to dig up the driveway is $30K+ and the association will not approve me to dig a trench in it.
I’m stuck with 120v at this point. Luckily I only need to add a maximum of 75kWh each week which should not hurt the Porsche on-board charger. Porsche determined after the fact in a Feb/2022 service bulletin that charging more than 12 hours at 120v should only be used in emergencies, implying daily use greater than 12 hours was degrading the on board charger or the 120V charger itself.
They were legally unable to mandate this change to owners which purchased their vehicles with no such restriction at purchase without opening them up to a class action suit.
If the charging system components were designed but manufactured improperly (in China) and it turns out they won’t last the life of the vehicle (>8 years of constant daily use) then Porsche will have to live with these unexpected warranty expenses. It’s not hard to design electronics to last 8+ years at constant daily use. There are 3 potential failure modes of a charger. Improperly sized or inferior wiring or components, sub standard assembly practices leading to premature failures or not properly accounting for thermal stresses from operation in addition to the ambient temperature around the unit.
I live in California where the vehicle sits in a cool garage at 50-80F and briefly sees up to 105F for a few hours a day for up to 60 days.
This is nothing compared to living in Pheonix where temps exceed 125 during the summer.
Porsche did not design close to these temperatures. It is likely the manufacturer in China built these suspect quality parts for Porsche and it’s coming back to haunt Porsche.

Tesla did the only smart thing they could do at the time and limit the charging to 32A to minimize the warranty risk imposed by the use of a circuit only wired to handle 32A.
Any licensed electrician would catch this discrepancy but there are many ignorant homeowners that would not catch wiring issue and simply assume if the plug fits, have a handyman install a 40A breaker that they are fine to run 40A.
These people deserve to have their houses burn down from their own stupidity but Tesla would lose the PR battle in the media when one of their cars catches fire in a garage.
Porsche is in a bit of a tough spot. If they mandate a limit to the charging time or current below what was in the spec at time of sale or if they make it mandatory that the charger turns off after 12 hours on a daily basis then they will be required to pay restitution to every owner they sold the unlimited use of the 120V charger. They will hopefully replace the on-board chargers with a newer version which meets Porsche reliability standards going forward but it takes time for the substandard modules with the high failure rate to get beyond the warranties.

My 2021 Taycan is about to turn 3 years on January 5th and I’ve never used the 120V charger except to plug it in once after I installed it in my garage to see that it worked.
I have only charged at EA for the past 13 months. I bought the vehicle with 30K miles on it and put another 7K on it since November 2023. No fires, no charging system or battery issues.
Until last week…
My onboard charging system failed on December 23rd. My dealer said this is a common failure they see on all the early Taycan’s through 2022.
My Taycan was originally delivered on 1/5/22 so your point about the on board charger being not a robust design appears to be a fair observation but I believe it is due to substandard manufacturing from their supplier in China.
I believe Porsche will quietly fix the quality issues/weaknesses in the on board charger over the next year or two. They will breath a sigh of relief when the standard & extended vehicle warranties have expired which for me is 2030.
Until then Porsche will be on the hook for my main battery as well as the charging system components.
Since I don’t drive it more than 150 miles per week the charging system in my Taycan is on vacation so to speak in my garage or even if I charge once a week at EA.
This is not a surprise when it comes to new models.
I bought a 2000 Boxster convertible in early 2001 after reading so many reports of the early Boxsters (1997, 1998 & 1999) suffering a multitude of recalls, repairs and overall unreliable operation.
The 2000 Boxster ended up proving to be one of the most reliable and problem free of the Porsche lineup.
It was bulletproof until I got t-boned by a drunk driver in 2021 at 42K miles.
It was a sad day.
I expect Porsche will get all the bugs out of their EV platforms over a bit longer period but I would tend to believe the 2025 models and beyond will become bulletproof as well.
I would love to see data showing the number of recalls & repair stats for the Taycan from when it was first introduced to 2025. I expect these numbers will drop significantly from year to year until it finally reaches a normal rate for mature products by 2025 to 2026.
I do think my 2021 will prove to be a reliable platform eventually especially if I only drive it 150 miles a week…
 

whitex

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I would love to install 220V service but my garage is on the other side of the common area driveway in my community so the cost to dig up the driveway is $30K+ and the association will not approve me to dig a trench in it.
If you have a 120V circuit of your own in the garage which can can dedicate to the car, you can have an electrician change it to 240V (install a 240V outlet, or hardwire an EVSE), same wiring (so no digging), same amperage, but twice the voltage (most wires are rated up to 600V). This would double your current charging speed (if it's a 15A circuit, that would yield you 2.9kW, 20A circuit would yield 3.8kW - both more than sufficient for what you say your needs are).

Another possible workaround is to get one of those 10-20kWh power banks which people use for camping/RV. It can charge in your garage 24/7 from 120V and it should have a 240V RV plug which could charge your Taycan fast whenever needed (as fast as 11kW, depending on EVSE and the power bank).

My onboard charging system failed on December 23rd. My dealer said this is a common failure they see on all the early Taycan’s through 2022.
My Taycan is a 2023 and my onboard charger died a week before yours. I don’t think much has changed in 2023/2024 models as far as the onboard charger.

My Taycan was originally delivered on 1/5/22 so your point about the on board charger being not a robust design appears to be a fair observation but I believe it is due to substandard manufacturing from their supplier in China.
Actually the J1 onboard charger has been manufactured in Ireland since the beginning.
 
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mikeyyn

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Just opened the My Porsche app and it very helpfully had an ad for an outdoor car cover for my Taycan.
Timely, in view of the advice not to park it indoors.
It’s incredibly considerate of Porsche to think of me.

Porsche Taycan High Voltage Battery Recall EXPANDED - ARB6 & ARB7 IMG_4784
 

Gino

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If you have a 120V circuit of your own in the garage which can can dedicate to the car, you can have an electrician change it to 240V, same wiring, same Amperage, but twice the voltage (most wires are rated up to 600V). This would double your current charging speed.

Another possible workaround is to get one of those 10-20kWh power banks which people use for camping/RV. It can charge in your garage 24/7 from 120V and it should have a 240V RV plug which could charge your Taycan fast whenever needed.


My Taycan is a 2023 and my onboard charger died a week before yours. I don’t think much has changed in 2023/2024 models as far as the onboard charger.


Actually the J1 onboard charger has been manufactured in Ireland.
I’m waiting until January when my free charging at EA expires to see if charging at 120V for 8-12 hours is enough to give me at least 49-50 miles per day & 150-200 miles per week.

The California electric code requires two circuits in the garage. One 15A, 120V circuit dedicated for lighting only and one 20A 120V circuit for the garage door opener & everything else.
If I convert the 20A 120V circuit to 220V/240V it will violate the California Electric Code. I already tried to get a permit but was denied.
I’m keeping my fingers crossed I will be able to charge overnight for 12 hours every night at a minimum charging rate of 4 miles/hour or 48 miles per night. Worst case it would take 4 days to fully charge. We never drive more than 150 in a single day over a 7 day period so 120V charging should be fine.
I only use my 3 other ICE vehicles for long trips and maybe once or twice a year I’ll take the Taycan. The more gas/diesel drops in price my ICE vehicles actually are more economical to drive long distance than an EV.
I pay $2.05 to $2.25/gallon in Nevada & Utah so charging at EA for $0.64/kWh is not worth taking the Taycan on ski trips when my Hummer costs roughly the same and is perfect for our annual ski trips.
I have considered getting a power bank as well but I think the 120V charging should be enough as well as honoring Porsche’s service bulletin to not charge longer than 12 hours.
Worst case I may have to charge at a fast charger along the way on a rare long trip.
I’m dying to pull the 14/2 & 12/2 romex wires between the house & the garage but If I don’t need to then I won’t.
Replacing both wires with 8/3 so I can put a sub-panel in the garage would be ideal so I could run two 120 circuits to meet code from the sub-panel as well as a 240V circuit for the EV charger. Unfortunately I only have a 125A panel in the house but the main breaker & wiring that feeds the panel is limited to 100A max.
I’ll cross that bridge I’m forced to.
The wiring has been buried for almost 40 years. 1/2” metal conduit which is likely rusted away. No electrician will touch it.
Luckily my wife is retired and I’m a nanotechnology consultant that works from home or I travel cross country & internationally 50-75% of the year.
I can’t wait to get my Taycan back with the new on board charger so I can test it out.
I’m more inclined to buy another home so I can buy another Porsche or two.

We live so close to everything that the longest drive to get anywhere is only 15-20 miles away.
Worst case we’ll always start with at least 100 miles available every morning since we rarely get below 50 miles returning home at the end of an evening. That’s why I’m fine if the range drops to 100 miles after 10+ years. It will be a fancy golf cart to drive around town to shop, drink & eat!
Just opened the My Porsche app and it very helpfully had an ad for an outdoor car cover for my Taycan.
Timely, in view of the advice not to park it indoors.
It’s incredibly considerate of Porsche to think of me.

IMG_4784.jpg
I had a beautiful car cover once like this and it was stolen within weeks by cutting around the grommets where the locking cable was attached. They left me the locking cable so I could use it on another car cover I’m sure they would also steal… There are garages for a reason…
 
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Dr Monty

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Notified by email today from NHTSA that the previous High Voltage Short Circuit issue has been expanded. This issue is associated with a fire risk. Letters are being mailed on or about 11/29/24 with a projected first quarter fix. Porsche will install advanced diagnostic software and will notify affected owners. If affected, they will advise not to charge above 80% until the battery module can be replaced. My guidance is not to charge above 80% until the car can be diagnosed (Q1 2025).

You might want to consider not charging in your garage, which has been my practice since 2021.

Porsche internal designation is recall ARB6 & ARB7.

Here is the link for the recalls, both were dated 10/01/2024:
https://www.nhtsa.gov/recalls?nhtsaId=24V731 This covers 2020-2023 Taycan

https://www.nhtsa.gov/recalls?nhtsaId=24V732 This covers 2020-2024 Taycan

It seems that this issue has finally made its way across the Pacific to Japan. A few days ago (another) recall notice came for my 2021 4S CT for what is described as a "high voltage module" issue which must be rested and possibly replaced. There were dire warnings given about chance of a fire, and if I must drive don't charge above 80%, etc. Perhaps the message is it is a bit over dramatic, as I am in Japan, where they tend to err on the side of extreme caution.

So with only 14% battery left, I decided to charge up so that I can make it to the dealer which is 120km away. However, the car won't charge on my 40amp/ 200V home charger. (Which charges my BMW iX50 just fine). The light in the charge port just blinks white, which makes me think the "high voltage module” has indeed failed. I guess I should be glad it hasn’t caught fire.

It is a fine car when running, but I think this is the 6th or 7th recall… And don’t get me started on the resale value which for a very low mileage, garage queen is less than 50% after three years.
 
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It seems that this issue has finally made its way across the Pacific to Japan. A few days ago (another) recall notice came for my 2021 4S CT for what is described as a "high voltage module" issue which must be rested and possibly replaced. There were dire warnings given about chance of a fire, and if I must drive don't charge above 80%, etc. Perhaps the message is it is a bit over dramatic, as I am in Japan, where they tend to err on the side of extreme caution.

So with only 14% battery left, I decided to charge up so that I can make it to the dealer which is 120km away. However, the car won't charge on my 40amp/ 200V home charger. (Which charges my BMW iX50 just fine). The light in the charge port just blinks white, which makes me think the "high voltage module” has indeed failed. I guess I should be glad it hasn’t caught fire.

It is a fine car when running, but I think this is the 6th or 7th recall… And don’t get me started on the resale value which for a very low mileage, garage queen is less than 50% after three years.
I am no expert by any means, but if the vehicle will not charge, its not a known symptom of the battery recall. Either a software glitch on an onboard charger failure.
 

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Mine was originally sent for cell replacement and then changed to a new battery. I have been without the car 3 months. Latest update is the new battery is to arrive this week. Once that and the brake recall are completed, I will get the car back. The time it is taking to do the diagnosis on whether the module replacement is an option for each battery pack is taking ridiculously long because the battery pack is removed from the car and shipped to Oklahoma.
I had a battery fault error about a month ago and had to have it towed to service. 2020 4S. They found Cells 1-6 were dead. Then I got the recall notice just after.. lol Anyway, I was told by service that they are waiting on Porsche on whether they will replace just the cells or the battery depending on which is cheaper. I'm not sure how this affects what would have been done with the recall since it was an actual failure. I was expecting 3 months but with the recall I think it will be longer as I'm sure they are backed up. I have had the car in the shop far too often and so I filed a lawsuit. I've had the car less than 2 years and its been in the shop over 8 months... and counting. We will see. I did get a 25 Taycan loaner at least. It is a better car than Gen 1. Small but noticeable improvements. But I digress. The possibilty of the warranty not being extended on the new cells/battery is a concern.

Please keep us posted on the outcome with your battery. Thanks
 
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Tooney

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I had a battery fault error a a couple months ago and had to have it towed to service. 2020 4S. They found Cells 1-6 were dead. Then I got the recall notice just after.. lol Anyway, I was told by service that they are waiting on Porsche on whether they will replace just the cells or the battery depending on which is cheaper. I'm not sure how this affects what would have been done with the recall since it was an actual failure. I was expecting 3 months but with the recall I think it will be longer as I'm sure they are backed up. I have had the car in the shop far too often and so I filed a lawsuit. I've had the car less than 2 years and its been in the shop over 8 months... and counting. We will see. I did get a 25 Taycan loaner at least. It is a better car than Gen 1. Small but noticeable improvements. But I digress. The possibilty of the warranty not being extended on the new cells/battery is a concern.

Please keep us posted on the outcome with your battery. Thanks
Your car was towed to service several months ago for a battery fault and it is still waiting for Porsche to decide on how to repair?????? How long exactly?
 

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I had a battery fault error about a month ago and had to have it towed to service. 2020 4S. They found Cells 1-6 were dead. Then I got the recall notice just after.. lol Anyway, I was told by service that they are waiting on Porsche on whether they will replace just the cells or the battery depending on which is cheaper. I'm not sure how this affects what would have been done with the recall since it was an actual failure. I was expecting 3 months but with the recall I think it will be longer as I'm sure they are backed up. I have had the car in the shop far too often and so I filed a lawsuit. I've had the car less than 2 years and its been in the shop over 8 months... and counting. We will see. I did get a 25 Taycan loaner at least. It is a better car than Gen 1. Small but noticeable improvements. But I digress. The possibilty of the warranty not being extended on the new cells/battery is a concern.

Please keep us posted on the outcome with your battery. Thanks
What was the nature of the lawsuit and what are you asking for?
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