Does charging at 110 interfere with electric use in my sons house and will it be enough?

[Mikegrr]

My son lives 110 miles away. If I visit Him for the weekend , I’d like to Charge the car while I’m there. I have the smaller battery and I figure if I start the trip at 100% , I should be at around 50% or so when I get there . If I leave the car plugged in for 24 hours @ 110 how much charge will I get…. I’m guessing around an additional 25%. I think this will allow me to make it back home without a stop.
Is this a good estimate?
also will leaving the car plugged in that long interfere with the electric use in the house? I guess this is silly question but I’m not sure if it will. After all, the refrigerator is plugged in 24/7.

thanks for putting up with my ignorance.

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[TaycanCook]

To answer your question, we'd have to understand the specific circuit that it's plugged into, i.e. what is that branch rated for, 20amp? and we'd have to understand what else is plugged into that circuit.

I believe the 120/110 draw from the EVSE is 15 amps. If it's on the 20 amp circuit with light additional usage on top of it, i.e. a few lights, you're fine. If you're on a 20 amp circuit, and you run something with a higher load like a hair dryer, microwave or a power tool, you'll trip the circuit (assuming this is a newer build home vs. older build homes).

 

[daveo4EV]

My son lives 110 miles away. If I visit Him for the weekend , I’d like to Charge the car while I’m there. I have the smaller battery and I figure if I start the trip at 100% , I should be at around 50% or so when I get there . If I leave the car plugged in for 24 hours @ 110 how much charge will I get…. I’m guessing around an additional 25%. I think this will allow me to make it back home without a stop.
Is this a good estimate?
also will leaving the car plugged in that long interfere with the electric use in the house? I guess this is silly question but I’m not sure if it will. After all, the refrigerator is plugged in 24/7.

thanks for putting up with my ignorance.

if you're using the PMC+/PMCC w/120V power supply cable the EVSE (the charger) will pull 12 amps - or 1.44 kW

most/all 120/110V outlets in most/all North American homes are "shared" - i.e. multiple plugs where multiple items/devices could be using the same wire/breaker - as said above it all depends what else is on that same circuit/breaker - and if it's actually being used while you're charging the vehicle…

there are two common breaker sizes for North American household outlets - 15 amps - and 20 amps - _IF_ the circuit you're using is a 15 amp breaker then you have 3 "amp" buffer - if the circuit you're using is a 20 amp breaker then you will have an 8 amp buffer…

lights won't matter (unless they are halogens or incandescents) but items such as (but not limited to)

• microwaves
• heaters
• coffee makers
• hair dryers
• refrigerators
• hot plates
• toaster ovens
• air flyers
• instapots
• souvis wands
• plasma TV's
• portable air-conditioners
• etc

all can pull more than 1000-1500 watts (1 kw) which is about 8-14 amps (or more)

using any one of these items at a time is no problem - using more than one of these items on the SAME breaker will most likely lead to the breaker tripping due to overload (pulling more power than the breaker is rated)

your PMC+/PMCC will pull 12 amps

options:

• the PMC+ has a 50% button - that will lower it's load to 6 amps - or about 800 watts - this can be done to "be safe" and will provide more room/buffer on the shared circuit to avoid tripping the breaker
  • but will also slow down the charge rate and simply may not be worth it in terms of battery capacity added per-hour…
  • it might be so slow as to be inconsequential and pointless.
• the PMCC has an LCD screen and you can adjust the amps in 1(one) amp increments - I would dial it down to 8-10 amps
  • again this may be pointless given how slow it will make the charging.

recommendations

• test the circuit - I would plug in the PMC+/PMCC and then flip breakers to find out which breaker is associated with the plug you're using
• I would then attempt to see what other devices/appliances "share" that same breaker - if there is nothing of consequence - there is probably no problem running the PMC+/PMCC for charging - since while it pulls a lot of power - if it's the only one doing it there is less of an issue
• if it turns out to be "shared" and other appliances/devices are on the same breaker - you have options
  • turn down the power demand on the PMC+/PMCC as noted above
  • unplug the other appliances to avoid them "conflicting" with the PMC+/PMCC charging
  • simple verify those appliance won't be used while charging
  • find another plug that isn't sharing it's breaker/circuit with high-demand appliances

it should be noted - charging at 120/110V is/will:

• take about 3 days from 5% to 95% to charge the Taycan
• adds less than 2%/hour of battery
• is not recommended by Porsche official NTSB document for more than 12 hours
  • Porsche considers it for "emergency use only" to gain power to drive to a proper fast charger or 240V/L2 charger - see link provided w/Porsche's PDF attached.

https://www.taycanforum.com/forum/t...-related-porsche-ntsb-article-analysis.13902/

from Porsche's NTSB article

General Precautions on (125V) Supply Cable Use
The “domestic” (125V) supply cable is provided for emergency use only, and should not be used by customers for daily home charging. Please discuss installation and use of a suitable 250V circuit with all customers.
…
When used, it is recommended to limit 125V charging to a maximum of approximately 12 hours. Charge only to a minimum needed get to a nearest High-Power Charger (HPC) or DC Charger for recharging.

honestly I wouldn't stress about charging at 120/110 volt - dial down the amps to 50% w/PMC+ or 8 amps with PMCC - but consider it "trickle charging" and do the following:

• find near by fast chargers (L2 or CCS)
• look for a waterheater/electric dryer plug that you can use to charge the Taycan

charging w/120V is just painful slow and not recommend (Porsche's words not mine), and potentially impacts other appliances/devices in the home because of the potential for overload on a shared 15/20 amp 120V circuit.

 

[Tooney]

sous vide wands? Had to look that device up. Must be a west coast thing...

 

[daveo4EV]

My son lives 110 miles away. If I visit Him for the weekend , I’d like to Charge the car while I’m there. I have the smaller battery and I figure if I start the trip at 100% , I should be at around 50% or so when I get there . If I leave the car plugged in for 24 hours @ 110 how much charge will I get…. I’m guessing around an additional 25%. I think this will allow me to make it back home without a stop.
Is this a good estimate?
also will leaving the car plugged in that long interfere with the electric use in the house? I guess this is silly question but I’m not sure if it will. After all, the refrigerator is plugged in 24/7.

thanks for putting up with my ignorance.

running at a full 12 amps the PMC+/PMCC will provide 1.44 kW of "raw" power - the standard battery has a gross capacity of 79.2 kWh according to Porsche's north american website - I'm going to assume 74 kWh of "usable power"

1.44 kW of "raw" power will equate to about 1.2 kW of power "hitting" the battery - so each hour of charging will provide 1.2 kWh of battery capacity

1.2 kWh / 74 kWh = 1.6% capacity for each hour of charge

24 hours of charging would therefore provide about 38% capacity restoration - give or take - let's be conservative and suggest you will get 35% capacity for each full 24 hour charge period

personally I see you're in florida - Florida has pretty good fast charging and public charging - I'd fire up plugshare and find what charging infrastructure is near your son's home, or look for a neighbor that owns an EV and ask/arrange to use their EV charging while visiting your son…

NOTE: 50% capacity (your estimated usage to visit your son) is about 40 kWh of power - 40 kWh of power at an any Electrify america CCS charging station is about a 15 minute (or less) charging stop…at 150 kW station - 10 min at a 350 kW charging station…

the Taycan has world class fast charging - I'd use it…versus dicking around with super super super slow 120V charging on a household outlet - you'll spend more time dicking around with setting up/tearing down the the EV charger at your son's home (and moving cars around so your Taycan can reach the plug) vs. the 15 min stop at Electrify American to/from your son's home…

also refrigerators don't use power continously like an EV charger, they cycle on/off and when on tend to only use 200-400 watts - the defrost cycle for a fridge is where all the power usage comes from - about 1200-1500 watts, but the defrost cycle is only done 1 or 2 times each 3 or 4 days…so mostly fridges don't use a lot of power…they can use a lot of power for an hour or so for defrost cycle, but 1 hour of 1200 watts every 2-4 days - is nothing compared to an EV charger using 1.44 kW with _NO BREAKS_ or idle periods for 24+ hours straight…

I hope this helps.

 

[daveo4EV]

My son lives 110 miles away. If I visit Him for the weekend , I’d like to Charge the car while I’m there. I have the smaller battery and I figure if I start the trip at 100% , I should be at around 50% or so when I get there . If I leave the car plugged in for 24 hours @ 110 how much charge will I get…. I’m guessing around an additional 25%. I think this will allow me to make it back home without a stop.
Is this a good estimate?
also will leaving the car plugged in that long interfere with the electric use in the house? I guess this is silly question but I’m not sure if it will. After all, the refrigerator is plugged in 24/7.

thanks for putting up with my ignorance.

you could also suggest/pay for an electrician to install a NEMA 14-50/6-50 plug/outlet (or 14-30/6-30) for when you visit…this could be less than $500 with a willing electrician and is generically useful for your son and future owners of the home - as then there will be proper infrastructure in the garage for charging an EV or Hybrid…

EV chargers compatible w/Taycan (and other hybrids/EV's) can be had for $250'ish - so you wouldn't even need to bring an EV charger with you…to be clear this is 100% optional - you can bring your own EVSE with you and simply use any 240V outlet you have installed at your son's home - it's purely for convience that I note there are affordable EV chargers - you can bring your own and to reduce costs only a 240V outlet is required.

I made it a project w/my-son to add a NEMA 6-50 outlet for his EV and my EV at his apartment (with landlord's consent) - it took 2-3 hours work and less than $300 in materials - and volia a high quality NEMA 6-50 outlet for my son's usage, my usage, and any future occupant's usage…

https://www.taycanforum.com/forum/t...n-be-almost-trivial…it-took-me-2-hours.12194/

adding a 240V outlet to a fairly modern home in a garage can be easy and affordable and provides a nice upgrade to the home and will provide excellent EV charging support for when you visit…I'd consult with a local licenced/bonded electrician - this could be cheap/easy and then you're set.

 

[irrelevant]

I agree 110v isn’t ideal, but it seems like we’re talking about a negligible amount of extra charge required to make it back home.

I’d plug it in, check back in an hour to verify the breaker hasn’t tripped, and enjoy the time with my son. No need to overcomplicate things when all the mission requires is an extra 20-30 miles of range to feel comfortable.

 

[Jayyvr890]

Porsche no longer recommends charging with 110v supply unless in emergency situations. The charge rate is so slow you will risk depleting the 12V which runs the cooling and electronics while the HV battery charges. A couple hours will be fine but leaving it for extended periods might leave you with a dead 12-V

 

[Mikegrr]

A lot of useful info here. Let me digest it all and come to a decision. 220 miles is just about the range of the car and my wife gets nervous if I cut it too close.

 

[TXAG]

A lot of useful info here. Let me digest it all and come to a decision. 220 miles is just about the range of the car and my wife gets nervous if I cut it too close.

Why not briefly stop at a high-powered DC charger along the way?

 

[dtich]

I agree 110v isn’t ideal, but it seems like we’re talking about a negligible amount of extra charge required to make it back home.

I’d plug it in, check back in an hour to verify the breaker hasn’t tripped, and enjoy the time with my son. No need to overcomplicate things when all the mission requires is an extra 20-30 miles of range to feel comfortable.

Yeah. Agree. Dave's post was fully in-depth and thorough, and all correct, but... BUT... I have visited people for the weekend and plugged into the spare or utility 110 outlet in the garage the whole time and the bump to SoC was helpful if not overwhelming. It is *painfully* slow but unless your house wiring is on the edge of acceptable, it should not be an issue. It is the equivalent of leaving a hair dryer on all weekend, so it will cost them something . And: obviously try to pick a branch circuit with nothing else on it! OR, or, OR, unplug their 220VAC dryer and plug the car in there for a spell

 

[SergeyIndy]

@daveo4EV, always excellent advice with comprehensive analysis.
I wonder if you could help me understand how much pull 220V Clothing Dryer plug would be useful for in emergency situations for overnight charging.

 

[daveo4EV]

most electric dryers are 30 amps - EVSE's with NEMA 14-30/6-30 power supply cables will subsequently pull 24 amps from such a setup.

watts = volts * amps

240V * 24 amps = 5,760 watts or 5.76 kW (kilowatts)

each hour of charger on a 30 amp circuit is therefore 5.76 kWh minus overhead… - let's call it 5.3 for estimation purposes

so charging the big-battery Taycan has 83.4 kWh of capacity - a full 100% charge is therefore 83.4 kWh -

so 83.4 kWh / 5.3 kW = 15.9 hours give or take - 14-17 hours for a FULL 100% charge from nearly empty on a normal residential home 240V 30 amp circuit.

 

[daveo4EV]

@daveo4EV, always excellent advice with comprehensive analysis.
I wonder if you could help me understand how much pull 220V Clothing Dryer plug would be useful for in emergency situations for overnight charging.

see analysis above - 30 amps isn't honestly that bad for an overnight charge - it's more doable if you're not completely empty - but you can get decent capacity overnight with a 30 amp circuit (24 amp charge rate).

the trick is having the NEMA 14-30/6-30 power supply adapter cable - Porsche sells these for the PMC+/PMCC - but they charge like $170 for each cable - you can get an entire separate EVSE for that kind of money with more power supply adapters for $400 or less…

but yeah if you have an EVSE w/6-30 or 14-30 power supply cable 5.76 kW is a decent charge rate (5x faster than a normal home outlet).

 

[daveo4EV]

@daveo4EV, always excellent advice with comprehensive analysis.
I wonder if you could help me understand how much pull 220V Clothing Dryer plug would be useful for in emergency situations for overnight charging.

this thread lays out expected charge times for all the common North American outlet types and their typical power capacities…

given regional variation and voltage variations exact times are always hard to come with - but these numbers are excellent ball park figures and will set accurate (if not precise) expectations the general duration of a charge session for a given circuit if you know it's breaker size.

https://www.taycanforum.com/forum/t...-it-take-to-charge-my-taycan-from-blah.12279/

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