[CONFIRMED&DANGEROUS] 9J1.2 LETS YOU DRIVE WITH POOR ISOLATION AS WELL

[Rik_CT4s]

At the end of the day it's a BMS software issue. I wonder why they didn't fix it yet.
There's no way at this point they are un-aware of it.

I wonder if some complaints to NTHSA/EU equivalent would make them take some action towards fixing this

Yeah, I totally agree — people really should start officially bringing this up, ideally with detailed reports attached. Just wondering, has @ct14garage ever raised this directly with Porsche?
I’d be surprised if they weren’t already aware of it, but it’s hard to believe they wouldn’t be listening to these experiences if enough owners report it through the proper channels.

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[Rik_CT4s]

Interesting case, and it is good that experiences like this are being shared. I certainly do not doubt the knowledge or skill of @ct14garage who worked on it. Again nice find.

It is worth keeping in mind though that this happened in Thailand, where there are no official Porsche dealers. That means software updates, service campaigns and potential recalls may be delayed or not implemented at all. Combined with the tropical climate, with high humidity, heat and heavy rainfall, conditions like these can make leaks or isolation issues develop much faster than they would here (talking about EU and nothern America)

One incident, however serious, does not mean that all 150,000 Taycans are at risk. Lets not get in another panic mode like last time when we all thought 60% of the batteries were bad and need replacements just 1 hour after 8 years of warranty.

Interesting case, and it is good that experiences like this are being shared. I certainly do not doubt the knowledge or skill of @ct14garage who worked on it. Again nice find.

It is worth keeping in mind though that this happened in Thailand, where there are no official Porsche dealers. That means software updates, service campaigns and potential recalls may be delayed or not implemented at all. Combined with the tropical climate, with high humidity, heat and heavy rainfall, conditions like these can make leaks or isolation issues develop much faster than they would here (talking about EU and nothern America)

One incident, however serious, does not mean that all 150,000 Taycans are at risk. Lets not get in another panic mode like last time when we all thought 60% of the batteries were bad and need replacements just 1 hour after 8 years of warranty.

Just ordered a humidity sensor, rubber boots, and booked therapy for my range anxiety.

 

[jk981]

Just ordered a humidity sensor, rubber boots, and booked therapy for my range anxiety.

I'm not understanding the reason behind being flippant about this issue or trying to minimize it. Ct14garage isn't trying to sell a snake oil fix for a non-existent issue, is he? If it were me, I'd prefer to know if my car was a rolling time bomb, rather than being left in the dark, even if the chances of this happening are extremely minimal.

The chances of my house burning down are pretty minimal, and yet I don't scoff at the smoke detectors on my ceiling.

 

[Rik_CT4s]

I'm not understanding the reason behind being flippant about this issue or trying to minimize it. Ct14garage isn't trying to sell a snake oil fix for a non-existent issue, is he? If it were me, I'd prefer to know if my car was a rolling time bomb, rather than being left in the dark, even if the chances of this happening are extremely minimal.

The chances of my house burning down are pretty minimal, and yet I don't scoff at the smoke detectors on my ceiling.

No worries — my comment was meant tongue-in-cheek, not to make light of the issue itself.
I do agree that if this turns out to be more than a one-off case, it’s definitely something Porsche should take seriously. I just try to keep a bit of humor in the mix while we wait to see how widespread it actually is.

 

[D00notD00d]

@ct14garage
Separate to the detection issue, what was the level of damage to the composite glass fibre battery protection plate, and where was the damage.
My thought is whether it offers any more protection than the the j1.2 metal plate. Apart from possible weight saving, added protection could be a reason for the material change.

Another lateral thought - does the Macan (and now Cayenne) safety monitoring logic differ from Taycan? The batteries may differ, but the safety requirements may be common across Porsche/the VW group.

 

[D00notD00d]

This is coolant and not flood water. That water escaped the battery's coolant system through a ruptured coolant passage and made its way into the modules. In this case the water DID NOT come from outside!!!

Apologies I misunderstood when you mentioned the compartment was waterlogged

 

[prj]

I don't think this is a common thing.
These battery cases are being pressure-tested and only a few don't qualify through QC and the only one that somehow managed to get through while it shouldn't ends up here in this topic.

That does not change anything about the problems of the BMS!
This situation would have never occurred if the BMS was programmed correctly.
When the coolant hit the battery it would have shut down. It should shut down regardless if it's water or coolant in there.

Your entire logic seems to be "not gonna happen to me". But what if it does? What if the car is in your garage and burns your entire house down? And good if only the house and not something else. All because of incorrectly programmed software issue.

I would make a much more devious suggestion here because it is impossible the engineers are not aware of this. I think they are purposely keeping the detection threshold super low, to somehow sail through the battery issues on the Taycans until the warranty runs out.

What I heard from OE sources (which of course I can not prove anything), is that Porsche is having issues with the majority of the early batteries and they are in full damage control mode at the moment. LG Chem settled a huge amount of money with Hyundai/Kia (same Rimac 800V architecture, same type of battery). I wonder if here the fault is actually not with LG, but with Porsche instead.

 

[Jasper4S]

Did you report it? Is Porsche aware?

 

[chun]

No worries — my comment was meant tongue-in-cheek, not to make light of the issue itself.
I do agree that if this turns out to be more than a one-off case, it’s definitely something Porsche should take seriously. I just try to keep a bit of humor in the mix while we wait to see how widespread it actually is.

It is more than a one off case. CT14 has been reporting this for years in j1.1.
Now this is the first j1.2 he reports it in.

What exactly makes you think it's a one off? Does your BMS run special magical software from Narnia?
Did the software of the BMS forget to work just for this specific instance? Even though it's clearly been reported since at least 4 years?

You do realize it's a software issue, right? Unless Porsche is incompetent enough to have different software for each car, aka around 200.000 software versions for the BMS, it is not a one off case.

It is widespread though all of the cars, because all of the cars run the same software. The issue is not the flooded battery, which can happen in however many ways, it's that the BMS doesn't recognize that the battery is flooded

 

[chun]

What I heard from OE sources (which of course I can not prove anything), is that Porsche is having issues with the majority of the early batteries and they are in full damage control mode at the moment. LG Chem settled a huge amount of money with Hyundai/Kia (same Rimac 800V architecture, same type of battery). I wonder if here the fault is actually not with LG, but with Porsche instead.

Would make sense, because I always found it insane that Porsche never went after LG, legally or contractually for all the defective cells; especially when there was precedent with Hyundai/Kia. Why would a company already bleeding money, willingly ignore a possible massive pay-check for a big issue, and likely a good PR win also.

 

[Dee]

That does not change anything about the problems of the BMS!
This situation would have never occurred if the BMS was programmed correctly.
When the coolant hit the battery it would have shut down. It should shut down regardless if it's water or coolant in there.

Your entire logic seems to be "not gonna happen to me". But what if it does? What if the car is in your garage and burns your entire house down? And good if only the house and not something else. All because of incorrectly programmed software issue.

I would make a much more devious suggestion here because it is impossible the engineers are not aware of this. I think they are purposely keeping the detection threshold super low, to somehow sail through the battery issues on the Taycans until the warranty runs out.

What I heard from OE sources (which of course I can not prove anything), is that Porsche is having issues with the majority of the early batteries and they are in full damage control mode at the moment. LG Chem settled a huge amount of money with Hyundai/Kia (same Rimac 800V architecture, same type of battery). I wonder if here the fault is actually not with LG, but with Porsche instead.

I'm just enjoying my car.

 

[Tooney]

It's possible that this serious battery problem situation has been seen in Taycans by Porsche dealer service departments. If so, it is unlikely that photos and descriptions of it would be shared with the public online (and/or the Taycan owners, most of whom seem unaware of details of dealer repair work.)

OR,

The only J1.2 Taycan in the world with this defect just happened to arrive at @ct14garage in Thailand, who documented and reported it to the public.

 

[D00notD00d]

Would make sense, because I always found it insane that Porsche never went after LG, legally or contractually for all the defective cells; especially when there was precedent with Hyundai/Kia. Why would a company already bleeding money, willingly ignore a possible massive pay-check for a big issue, and likely a good PR win also.

Are you certain LG didn’t cough up?
I’d speculate that any HvB Manufacturing Defect costs are recovered from LG under the warranty rather than being met by Porsche. I can’t imagine Porsche would pick up the tab. Less clear, liability for labour, storage and loan car costs. LG cannot validate those.

 

[Rik_CT4s]

It is more than a one off case. CT14 has been reporting this for years in j1.1.
Now this is the first j1.2 he reports it in.

What exactly makes you think it's a one off? Does your BMS run special magical software from Narnia?
Did the software of the BMS forget to work just for this specific instance? Even though it's clearly been reported since at least 4 years?

You do realize it's a software issue, right? Unless Porsche is incompetent enough to have different software for each car, aka around 200.000 software versions for the BMS, it is not a one off case.

It is widespread though all of the cars, because all of the cars run the same software. The issue is not the flooded battery, which can happen in however many ways, it's that the BMS doesn't recognize that the battery is flooded

Fair point — just to clarify, when I mentioned a “one-off,” I was referring specifically to the discovery of coolant intrusion in a J1.2, not the underlying BMS software issue, which is obviously a broader and ongoing concern.

 

[ct14garage]

The chances of my house burning down are pretty minimal, and yet I don't scoff at the smoke detectors on my ceiling.

This is the one phrase that stands out in this post. Chances of water making its way into your Taycan battery are altogether minimal be it from rain/flood or even coolant.

But when your battery is full of water, or leaking electricity due to deteriorated cells, the BMS will still allow you to charge and drive as normal. Ticking time bomb.


I cannot prove anything, but I would be willing to bet that a significant percentage of all the Taycans that have burned worldwide (except those caused by impact/accident) could have been prevented were the BMS programmed correctly

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