Baseline for HV Battery SoH Performance

[ron_b]

(from Mar 22, 2023)
Well I received my 2020 4S in Nov 2020 with 21 miles on the odometer.
I have tracked all 708 charging sessions since pickup.

1) Delivery Soh - unknown
2) Current SoH 90.55%
3) 53,285 miles
4) DCFC 13,102 kWh
L2 6,683 kWh
5) Build date July 2020

Avg efficiency 341 Wh/mi by calculation not cars fictitious reporting.

Location SF Bay Area, moderate climate

Story of Stealth, for anyone interested:
https://www.taycanforum.com/forum/threads/please-welcome-stealth.3531/

My current update.
1) Delivery Soh - unknown
2) Current SoH 88.9%
3) 62,109 miles / 99,952 km
4) DCFC 15,111 kWh
L2 8,029 kWh
5) Build date July 2020, Delivery November 2020

Avg efficiency 343 Wh/mi or 213 Wh/km by calculation not cars fictitious reporting.

Location SF Bay Area, moderate climate

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[ciaranob]

My current update.
1) Delivery Soh - unknown
2) Current SoH 88.9%
3) 62,109 miles / 99,952 km
4) DCFC 15,111 kWh
L2 8,029 kWh
5) Build date July 2020, Delivery November 2020

Avg efficiency 343 Wh/mi or 213 Wh/km by calculation not cars fictitious reporting.

Location SF Bay Area, moderate climate

Excellent thx - will post assp

 

[ciaranob]

My current update.
1) Delivery Soh - unknown
2) Current SoH 88.9%
3) 62,109 miles / 99,952 km
4) DCFC 15,111 kWh
L2 8,029 kWh
5) Build date July 2020, Delivery November 2020

Avg efficiency 343 Wh/mi or 213 Wh/km by calculation not cars fictitious reporting.

Location SF Bay Area, moderate climate

Chart updated.

Your Soh has maintained very well - almost anomalous TBH based on (crudely) extrapolated trends , but obviously no where near enough long term data for other cars as yet to say anything definitive - suspect many other car data will flatten out rapidly too; also SF is potentially a 'cooler' sub-zone within the broader climate zones as defined although yours still on the upper end of a projected Cool climate trend.

 

[TurboInCold]

Here is few more data points :

This one from beginning of June 2023 :
2) 91.31%
3) 18940 miles (30480km)
4) 837 kWh

This is from beginning of July 2023 before long road trip to central Europe :
2) 90.81%
3) 21125 miles (33999km)
4) 837 kWh

This is from current figures after the road trip :
2) 90.88%
3) 23900 miles (38475km)
4) 1389 kWh

It looks like that the battery degrading has stabilised after the first 20000 km / 12500 miles and has stayed the same since. Also the hammering on the autobahn and lots of DC charging on Ionity chargers on the road trip did not make any difference on the SoH figure.

Like I posted on other thread, based on my measurements on "(car reported consumption * distance driven on a charge) divided with battery percentage consumed" it seems that the car has had more available net capacity in the beginning than the promised 84kWh, and now after there is this 9% degradation the net capacity seems to be on this manufacturer promised 84kWh capacity.

It would be great if someone with very low mileage car could report those three values (consumption, distance, battery % used) from a longer trip to see if it would result 89 kWh net capacity like it had on mine when the car was almost new.

 

[ciaranob]

Here is few more data points :

This one from beginning of June 2023 :
2) 91.31%
3) 18940 miles (30480km)
4) 837 kWh

This is from beginning of July 2023 before long road trip to central Europe :
2) 90.81%
3) 21125 miles (33999km)
4) 837 kWh

This is from current figures after the road trip :
2) 90.88%
3) 23900 miles (38475km)
4) 1389 kWh

It looks like that the battery degrading has stabilised after the first 20000 km / 12500 miles and has stayed the same since. Also the hammering on the autobahn and lots of DC charging on Ionity chargers on the road trip did not make any difference on the SoH figure.

Like I posted on other thread, based on my measurements on "(car reported consumption * distance driven on a charge) divided with battery percentage consumed" it seems that the car has had more available net capacity in the beginning than the promised 84kWh, and now after there is this 9% degradation the net capacity seems to be on this manufacturer promised 84kWh capacity.

It would be great if someone with very low mileage car could report those three values (consumption, distance, battery % used) from a longer trip to see if it would result 89 kWh net capacity like it had on mine when the car was almost new.

Great stuff - Chart in Post #1 updated - yes whilst I am convinced the 'flash' or OBDII PCM reading of SoH is meaningful exactly what and how it is being measured or calculated is still most def uncertain.

 

[lcarron]

Hello Ciaranob

Last night I ran the OTA update for the battery (WNW2 high voltage software update). It took 5 minutes.
This morning I checked the SOH by curiosity.
It read 88.27 compared to 85.85 a week ago. This is a 2.42 % improvement. About 6 Miles in range.

Good luck to add that in your awesome data collection. Is Porsche starting to get into the 10% buffer?

Interesting, I think.

 

[ciaranob]

Hello Ciaranob

Last night I ran the OTA update for the battery (WNW2 high voltage software update). It took 5 minutes.
This morning I checked the SOH by curiosity.
It read 88.27 compared to 85.85 a week ago. This is a 2.42 % improvement. About 6 Miles in range.

Good luck to add that in your awesome data collection. Is Porsche starting to get into the 10% buffer?

Interesting, I think.

VERY interesting indeed - if I can get my bloody OTA to appear and load I will do the very same - also if others reading could consider too it might be revealing.

Be aware we've seen +/-1% on many cars between readings and a couple as much as 2% as I've stated elsewhere so you would not be alone there but over 2% I believe is a first.

Very curious.

PS: Maybe Porsche saw the chart in this thread and modified their Soh algorithm for better optics/metrics

 

[ciaranob]

EDITED - to add next post data from TurboInCold - 0.5% decrease
EDIT 2 = added my post-OTA Soh readout - no change (only few days apart)

For context re pre-post OTA update readouts - we have one and would def like more

Of 89 redouts to date from 53 cars, 81 OBDII readings show consistent Soh declines with increased mileage.

The remaining 8 OBDII redings show aslight incresae in Soh after short or long mileage additions (irrespective of climate zone):


Examples of readings that increased after varied increased mileage intervals:

Scandinavian France 88 to 89.9 = +1.9 %

icarron Nevada USA 87.5 to 85.9 = +1.6 %

Art in Scandinavia: 90.6 to 91.3 = +1.3 %

RS38 Germany 89.6 to 90.9 = + 1.3 %

MartyMeatBall NE USA 88.3 to 88.9 = + 0.6 %

RTH CA USA 85.9 to 86.4 = + 0.5 %

Scandinavian France 89.9 to 90.3 = +0.4 %

DEE Netherlands 90.3 to 90.4 = +0.1 %


Changes in Soh after the 2023 OTA applied:

Icarron 85.9 to 88.3 = + 2.4 %
TurboInCold 91.3 to 90.8 = - 0.5%
Ciaranob 88.9 to 88.9 = No change

Icarron's marked increase still not exactly an order of magnitude change and potentially just within std deviation for all the data.

Will def be curious to track later but very interested to have others contribute data pre- ad opst- the 2023 OTA update.

 

[TurboInCold]

My OTA of WNW2 was at 31863 km (19800 miles), and there were no improvement in SoH (figures reported two posts earlier).

i have found that SoH value is some 0.5% smaller if it is measured after a drive, and it increses a little if the car has been parked for day or more. I guess the reasoning is that while parked the BMS is working to balance the cell voltages.

 

[Scandinavian]

Interesting data emerging now! It will be nice to see how these graphs pan out when we get higher mileage and hopefully a larger sample.

As a side note, I had a taxi ride in a Tesla Model S from 2018 yesterday evening. As a taxi tolling from the Airport to town and back many times during 24 hours, the car had 702,000 km ( seven hundred two km!) . ON THE SAME BATTERY! It charged much slower than our Taycans, 1hour vs 22 min, but still held a range of 400 km per charge. So batteries can last a long time. And Stockholm gets quite cold in winter too. Guess the battery never cools down a lot though when used so much.

 

[ciaranob]

Well did the update and as with @TurboInCold and rs38 my Soh has not changed at all - exact same value today Jul 25 as taken July 18 i.e. still at 88.9%.

@lcarron - I do wonder if one of your readouts was a bit of an anomaly i.e. either the lowest reading at 85.9 or the post-OTA reading.

Notice that you I had a 1.6% drop in your last two pre-OTA readings from 87.5 to 85.9 i.e. the second highest in the database to date. The post-OTA readout of 88.3% measured from this low 85.9 of course gives a 2.4% increase but if for grins we measure instead the difference from the 87.5 readout (i.e assume the 85.9 anomalous) you only got a 0.8% increase from the post-OTA value of 88.3%

So again, if for some reason that 85.9% readout was just highly anomalous the rest of your data variation is well within the observed variations in most all of the other cars (+/- 1.5%).

Does not for a minute negate that you got that lowest readout but I guess the test will be point forward perhaps as to where your trend continues from - please keep us informed !

The only other cars with pre- and post- readouts are TurboInCold, rs38 and myself and all our car's Soh stayed exactly the same.

Cheers, C.

 

[rs38]

if ever possible, please also post some "supporting material" like SoC 100% to 0 or 1% drives with miles and consumption. Also even more interesting: how much do you charge from 0 to 100% AC checked at the "wall clock" or 0-100 at a DC station if possible?
Nice side effect: seems like these procedures also calibrate the BMS and it's SoH readings.

 

[ciaranob]

if ever possible, please also post some "supporting material" like SoC 100% to 0 or 1% drives with miles and consumption. Also even more interesting: how much do you charge from 0 to 100% AC checked at the "wall clock" or 0-100 at a DC station if possible?
Nice side effect: seems like these procedures also calibrate the BMS and it's SoH readings.

I've tracked my starting SoC for every at home AC charge which is to 85% with only a few pre-long trip exceptions and some of the trip DC charges. Have never let the car go less than 15% although I need to do that and back to 100%.

Had asked for some of this on initial survey but apparently a bit much for most folk to provide. I also posted my consumptive data in another thread so have all that tabulated too.

But agree, if others can begin to provide this type info too it might certainly help 'constrain' or 'calibrate' the raw OBDII 'flash' readings.

 

[Bognar67]

Hi, my SoH is exactly the same before/after the Update. 23 days and ca. 1,000 miles diff between the readouts.

SoH: 93,6%
Miles: 12,881

 

[ciaranob]

Hi, my SoH is exactly the same before/after the Update. 23 days and c.a 1,000 miles diff between the readouts.

SoH. 93,6%
Miles: 12,881

Thx - and for the update - indeed one out of 5 post-OTA to date has seen any significant change or positive increase so expectations set!


Post 1 chart updated.

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