(Brief!) Downsides of NOT having On-Board 150 kW / 400 V DC Charger

[Guards Red Car]

Hi,

I'm looking at a Nice CPO 2023 Taycan which does NOT have the Optional On-Board 150 kW / 400 V DC Charger

My Current 2021 Taycan has this option

I am just wondering if I will MISS this Option?

My present Charging Habits:
I charge at my House (Juice Box 48 Hard Wired) about 80 % of the time

I visit a nearby Electrify America station about 18 % of the time (hey, it's free juice for 3 years) - When they are online and working (150 kW or the 350 kW plugs), it is speedy and I can get all the range I need within the 30 minute free session

The other 2% would be at a random hotel/restaurant/public Level 2 charger

There is a nearby Tesla Magic Dock which I've experimented with once - It was SLOW and dismal in that the cord was TOO short!


My concerns:

Will my home charging speeds be significantly lengthened?

IF I decide to venture our on a sizeable road trip, will the lack of this 150 kW / 400 V DC On-Board Charger significantly limit my access to any public (high speed) chargers or significantly LENGTHEN my charge times?

With the opening up of the TESLA Network in the (near?) future, will I miss out on access and/or speed of charging?

Can I hurt my vehicle by plugging into a public charger which is too robust for the vehicle?

Will not having this option significantly affect resale value?


Thank you!

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[Caraholic]

Believe you will be limited to slow charging at the Tesla chargers when and if they open up the J1.

 

[Scandinavian]

Will my home charging speeds be significantly lengthened?

NO DIFFERENCE FOR HOME CHARGING

IF I decide to venture our on a sizeable road trip, will the lack of this 150 kW / 400 V DC On-Board Charger significantly limit my access to any public (high speed) chargers or significantly LENGTHEN my charge times?

COULD DO IF YOU NEED TO CHARGE UP AT A 400 VOLT STATION. BUT PERHAPS JUST DO A SHORT TOP UP AND GET TO THE NEXT 800 VOLT STATION?

With the opening up of the TESLA Network in the (near?) future, will I miss out on access and/or speed of charging?

WE CAN USE MOST TESLA SUPERCHARGERS IN EUROPE AND THE DIFFERENCE IN DPEED WILL BE NOTICABLE. BUT THERE IS NO DIFFERENCE YO ACCESS

Can I hurt my vehicle by plugging into a public charger which is too robust for the vehicle?

NO NOT AT ALL. THE CAR AND CHARGER WILL COMMUNICATE AND ADJUST.

Will not having this option significantly affect resale value?

PROBABLY. BUT PERHAPS YOU CAN TAKE THAT INTO ACCOUNT WHEN NEGOTIATING WITH THE DEALER NOW?

With your profile of charging, assuming this will stay the same in future, it will make very little difference in my opinion. If you need to rely on a lot of public chargers daily, I would avoid this car!

 

[hifi239]

Your charging at a Tesla SC (Magic Dock, and whenever the others open up) will be limited to 50kW. Looks like other than Magic Dock, the rollout to VW group will not happen for quite a while. Haven't even gotten to GM yet. On newer SC the cords will be longer.

"There is a nearby Tesla Magic Dock which I've experimented with once - It was SLOW and dismal in that the cord was TOO short!"

The charging at a Magic Dock SC with the 400V option should be 100-150kW depending on battery state/temp. Without, it will be 50kW (not that awful if you are in a jam). The cables are short and you have to park sideways. The benefit is that there are working SC farms in many CCS desert areas in the middle of nowhere so you have many more options (when and IF they ever open up to VW).

 

[SergeyIndy]

Short response: This option has nothing to do with home or any other AC charging. This is a DC only option and only works with 400V DC that can accommodate 150kW speeds that I understand only Tesla has when they become accessible. I have this option as it was not expensive to "future proof" but that future, I am afraid, is not going to happen as I cannot see anyone adding 400V DC stations or Tesla letting us use theirs at scale any time soon.

 

[Flying ace]

I am also looking at a CPO J1 Taycan. I've thought very hard about the situations and there's a ton of feedback in this thread that I posted on the topic: https://www.taycanforum.com/forum/t...aycans-charging-at-800v-stations-in-us.20575/

Just note without this option, the Taycan charges at 50kw on a 400v charger! Which is 1.5 hours from 5% to 80%.

My driving lifestyle is very similar to the one you described. My view is the 150kw/400v is reasonably important for road trips.

While it's the rare scenario, the only situation I can think of whereby you need the 400v charging is on road trips (or when you run a long day of errands around town/or forget to charge overnight). If and when Tesla gets done dragging their feet on opening up their network to 3rd party cars, just note ALL their chargers at the moment are 400v chargers. Note that in certain areas in US (socal) Electrify America is the de facto 800v charging provider. All other services (EVgo, EVConnect) primarily has 400v chargers. Even when Rivian opens up in the next 12 months, ALL Rivian chargers are 400v as well. Here is a recent thread on the disaster in supply demand imbalance with EA (800v) in a congested area. https://www.taycanforum.com/forum/t...less-you-can-charge-at-home-kyle-video.20992/


Balance the aforementioned rare scenario out with the fact you may also not need a full or 80% charge, meaning, you can be at about 30% SoC after a 30 minute charge at 50kw which is probably good enough (though annoying) to get you to your destination or a 800v charger. Though it'll be very inconvenient on a road trip e.g. in SoCal.

Also note, it's in my view the only service provider of 800v chargers is still EA for the foreseeable future. Ionna hasn't even launched their first station yet, and forget about Tesla rolling out their 800v units for the cybertruck, they can't even open up their network on time after firing everyone on the charging infrastructure team. Rivian doesn't have and hasn't committed to a 800v car so don't expect Rivian anytime soon.

Though my theory is that when Tesla opens up, many 400v cars (BMW, VWs, Audis, Ford, GM) will likely charge at Tesla, and this likely will lessen the demand and stress on EA, thereby likely improving reliability and availability. Also note, the newest cars are only offering 1 year or ###kws of free charging thereby soon disincentivizing new owners from constantly using EA.

Forum member @Jonathan S. is in the NE and can advise how region specific needs for 400v, but based on his assessment in my prior thread, it seems like 400v is critical in the NE.

 

[daveo4EV]

lack of the onboard 400V/150 kW charging has no effect on home charging (home charing via AC tops out at 22/19.2 kW)

you will be limited to 50 kW at 400V stations - (Tesla Superchargers) - it won't suck until it does…and it may never suck if you never need to charge at a Tesla station…

it's a stupid option and never should've been a choice - it's been removed from the Taycan Gen2 as a choice…

chances are you won't miss it - but should you "need" to charge at a Supercharger you're going to be there a while.

 

[DougFrisk]

Believe you will be limited to slow charging at the Tesla chargers when and if they open up the J1.

I'm thinking it's more if they open up. Tesla is slow walking this as hard as they possibly can.

 

[Caraholic]

I'm thinking it's more if they open up. Tesla is slow walking this as hard as they possibly can.

Yea have a feeling Porsche may leave us gen 1 owners out of the switch

 

[Jasper4S]

Don’t buy when you don’t need it today. Every option is a what-if option if you come up with reasons.

 

[jvincent]

All other services (EVgo, EVConnect) primarily has 400v chargers. Even when Rivian opens up in the next 12 months, ALL Rivian chargers are 400v as well.

In the US (excluding the Tesla Supercharger network) there are few, if any, >50kW chargers that aren't 800V capable. The Rivian DCFC installations, according to this data sheet, operate at 200-920V.

 

[snstevens]

lack of the onboard 400V/150 kW charging has no effect on home charging (home charing via AC tops out at 22/19.2 kW)

you will be limited to 50 kW at 400V stations - (Tesla Superchargers) - it won't suck until it does…and it may never suck if you never need to charge at a Tesla station…

it's a stupid option and never should've been a choice - it's been removed from the Taycan Gen2 as a choice…

chances are you won't miss it - but should you "need" to charge at a Supercharger you're going to be there a while.

@daveo4EV - I'm unclear on your comment "it's been removed from the Taycan Gen 2 as a choice". At first I thought that meant it had become Standard Equipment, but I can't seem to find that statement in the Configurator. Where can I find that info?

 

[wmras]

@daveo4EV - I'm unclear on your comment "it's been removed from the Taycan Gen 2 as a choice". At first I thought that meant it had become Standard Equipment, but I can't seem to find that statement in the Configurator. Where can I find that info?

150 kW DC charging is specified for Gen 2 and it may use the split-battery system used in the Macan Electric. The two 400V side-by-side resulting batteries can be charged on any 400V DC charger without a 150 kW DC 400V-to-800V charger option.

 

[FlyingPoint]

If it makes a difference, I have never used a 50kW charger in 3 1/2 years and doubt that it would be that large of an inconvenience. A 50 kW charger should permit at least 50-75 miles of additional driving in 30 minutes of charging time. This should be sufficient to get you to another DC charger that is more friendly than Tesla.

 

[Jonathan S.]

@daveo4EV - I'm unclear on your comment "it's been removed from the Taycan Gen 2 as a choice". At first I thought that meant it had become Standard Equipment, but I can't seem to find that statement in the Configurator. Where can I find that info?

I suspect they’re not emphasizing it too much given that its absence as standard equipment previously has condemned prior model years without that option to painfully slow charging at Magic Docks. Which is moot for some regions that lack them or have better options. The coverage is so wildly inconsistent.
It was also standard equipment on all model years of the etron GT.

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