Taycan Problem - potential catastrophic tire failure

[acull2000]

I have just experienced the same wear on Bridgestone Asymmetric 3 NF0's. Car is a GTS.

BUT - I have had the fronts on for circa 17,000miles and the rears for circa 19,000miles. This is a 2tonne+ 600Bhp car; I see that tyre wear and ultimate giving up as acceptable.

To put this is perspective my C8 RS6 would eat a set of Pirellis in about 15,000miles. Thats a car of similar weight and performance.

I have read a few instances on this thread of people complaining about wear after 20k?? These cars are not 190bhp fwd diesels. The tyres are fighting for their life from the moment they are fitted.

Heres how mine looked.

Front.

Rear.

As i say - given my experience of performance cars I feel this is actually good for the use.

Cheers.

Totally agree - my rears did ~16000miles which I’m happy with, given the tread was worn down pretty evenly to the minimum (eg I got my monies worth, and am not being needlessly wasteful).

What we’re trying to avoid is ‘premature’ failure that only some people seem to get on the inner shoulders. Yours look down to wear markers on rear and close on the front, so I’d say this is fair game. My fronts had to come off after 8000miles with still 4-5mm tread on them, due to the shoulders being down to canvas 🫣

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[Scandinavian]

Bridgestone???

I think they are GoodYear tyres?

I have had similar positive experience from the tyres but never seen any uneven wear

 

[Longy_UK]

Bridgestone???

I think they are GoodYear tyres?

I have had similar positive experience from the tyres but never seen any uneven wear

They are indeed! Sorry!

 

[Vim Schrotnock]

I have just experienced the same wear on Bridgestone Asymmetric 3 NF0's. Car is a GTS.

BUT - I have had the fronts on for circa 17,000miles and the rears for circa 19,000miles. This is a 2tonne+ 600Bhp car; I see that tyre wear and ultimate giving up as acceptable.

To put this is perspective my C8 RS6 would eat a set of Pirellis in about 15,000miles. Thats a car of similar weight and performance.

I have read a few instances on this thread of people complaining about wear after 20k?? These cars are not 190bhp fwd diesels. The tyres are fighting for their life from the moment they are fitted.

Heres how mine looked.

Front.

Rear.

As i say - given my experience of performance cars I feel this is actually good for the use.

Cheers.

This doesn't look like wear to me, it looks like a structural failure of the tire causing delamination. Your wear bars are still indicating some good tread left on the inner shoulder. As I said earlier, I don't think this is a tire wear issue, I think it is a stress issue where the tire delaminates due to excessive stress. The stress may be caused by improper alignment in certain settings or situations. I can say that my delamination was NOT caused by agressive driving. I don't drive my car like that on public roads.

This is a very interesting question - what is the cause of the delamination? It is definitely a basic defect in the car, and I would encourage everyone who has experienced this to report to the NHTSA.

https://www.nhtsa.gov/report-a-safety-problem

 

[acull2000]

For the reasons detailed in post #193, I don't think Goodyear or NHTSA will do much about it (the UK DVSA certainly didn't). Unless there are numerous owners who can firmly evidence they did not:
- have out of spec tracking at any point during the tyres life
- let the tyres go below specified pressures
- let the (dynamic) loads go above the rated values (and remember they are reduced below the 42psi reference pressure and above 210kph)
- use the tyres below 7degC
- go over 56mph in use range mode (which Porsche warn can wear tyres)

All they will do is simply use (or infer) one (or several) of these as possible clauses.

If in 15,000miles (knowing I will fastidiously stick to the above) I still have inner shoulder wear, I will be back to this topic!

 

[prj]

If in 15,000miles (knowing I will fastidiously stick to the above) I still have inner shoulder wear, I will be back to this topic!

Adjust the toe more neutral - on both axles the toe is positive (out). Adjust it to be just slightly less than the spec in the height you're using normally.

 

[Mr.Smith]

Adjust the toe more neutral - on both axles the toe is positive (out). Adjust it to be just slightly less than the spec in the height you're using normally.

From the factory is it toe neutral in every mode?

Only when I lowed the RS Etron GT by 10mm did I get that wear at 10k miles (PS4S). In stock form, the tires lasted 20k miles and it didn't have that wear (GoodYear F1)

 

[prj]

From the factory is it toe neutral in every mode?

Only when I lowed the RS Etron GT by 10mm did I get that wear at 10k miles (PS4S). In stock form, the tires lasted 20k miles and it didn't have that wear (GoodYear F1)

No, it's adjusted out from factory to make the car feel more lively.

 

[Mr.Smith]

No, it's adjusted out from factory to make the car feel more lively.

In the elasto-kinematic toe change technical talk, the speaker mentions the solution to the tire wear is to drive it harder and on more twisty roads

 

[SoccerMan94043]

Some toe experiments and nothing helped over three sets of tires. Changed rim size and to non-directional tires so they can be rotated left to right.

 

[prj]

Some toe experiments and nothing helped over three sets of tires. Changed rim size and to non-directional tires so they can be rotated left to right.

That's not what they are saying.
Listen at 5 minutes. They set more toe in and they said that sorted the fronts.
The rears still aren't great, but a huge improvement according to them.

 

[SoccerMan94043]

That's not what they are saying.
Listen at 5 minutes. They set more toe in and they said that sorted the fronts.
The rears still aren't great, but a huge improvement according to them.

Still ended up with the tears on the back... that's what I meant (even if it was better). No mention of his ride height, but considering he was commuting a 120 miles a day, mostly on the highway, I bet he was in range mode.

 

[prj]

Still ended up with the tears on the back... that's what I meant (even if it was better). No mention of his ride height, but considering he was commuting a 120 miles a day, mostly on the highway, I bet he was in range mode.

I mean yeah but they got 15000 miles out of the rears, that's really not even bad for a UHP tyre. And at some points they were below 3mm tread - like, I'd replace them at that point anyway.

I think the ticket is just set the toe a bit more neutral and then if you don't care about the UHP as much, run something that is non-directional, and just rotate them.
That way by the time you get the edge issue you've got no tread left anyway.

 

[SoccerMan94043]

Hopefully I won't find out for two years (I only drive about 6K miles a year), but wear like that on my PZero Rs might convince me to change to non-directional tires (if they are available for my rim size... I really not sure if any are rotatable left to right).

 

[acull2000]

This is interesting from Driftworks - I certainly agree with the failure mode being hard to detect (and potentially dangerous between the 2 year services).

Hard to interpret their numbers (in mm) - but assuming they mean total toe in and are on the 21" wheel, they said:

- Running the fronts at 2mm (0.11°) "totally solved" the problem - that's good news, since 0.11° is the Porsche spec! Why they'd have had the fronts at 0° toe beats me - and may have contributed to the car feeling skittish they mentioned, especially as you drop to range mode you loose another 0.05° toe - so running zero toe at normal ride height would lead to toe out on the front axle at lower ride heights!

- Bringing rear toe from 3mm (0.16°) to 2mm (0.11°) helped - well again, this is closer to the spec (0.09°), and since you add toe on the rear when reducing ride height, reducing toe at normal ride heigh is a good way to reduce toe wear (which is what I'm now convinced we're seeing).

Running the correct alignment (and pressures) has to be the solution to preventing premature tyre delamination on the inner shoulder

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