Taycan production slowdown

[snstevens]

Almost no one wants a 6 figure EV, and people like me don’t feel any “need” at all to trade “up” to a gen 2. We already know how that goes, Porsche should limit production to keep prices stable and create more market demand

Just for the record. Sales for Porsche increased in 2023 by 3% to 309,884 worldwide. “The Taycan also posted double-digit gains, with 40,629 customers taking delivery of their new car (+17 per cent).”

There were 50,146 sales of the 911, and 87,355 Macan sales. Largest seller was the new Cayenne at 87,553.

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[Uknown]

Almost no one wants a 6 figure EV, and people like me don’t feel any “need” at all to trade “up” to a gen 2. We already know how that goes, Porsche should limit production to keep prices stable and create more market demand

I would be open to them selling me a car for a steep steep discount to make sure they still know how , then they can get back to controlling inventory and prices ..hah.

 

[Uknown]

The repair costs are bonkers, and the lack of trained staff for the EV part is frustrating but I think /hope Macan helps solve this with volume local /regional dealers can justify the headcount for more EV certified techs…

I don’t really know anything but feel depreciation is not far off historical norms, while the Taycan wasn’t massive sales, it wasnt a limited run either, and the big rush /drop was a catch up and the fact the first round of leases, and general new car cycle for many in this luxury market happened to largely come due right as the car market was getting softer didn’t help. Maybe there is uncertainty on all these LG based battery cars too,,, so many manufacturer recalls on these, who knows. I don’t understand enough about the batteries and tech to feel super confident owning one of these for a decade is viable.

911 owners I suspect understand the costs to do that and know the reality better.

I wish Porsche did a better job assuring owners they can keep these on the road for a decade+ without costing more than the car is worth. So far the lack of expertise and communication from Porsche on that front is startling. I assume on the 911 side of the house and ICE side the history and local tech knowledge is much deeper.

 

[Uknown]

[QUOTE="snstevens, post: 313685, member: 1691]

I’m still not worried about depreciation and can’t help wonder but why so many others are. May I suggest that next time buy a less expensive car perhaps?

Well for me it’s not the price per se; it’s that the Taycan is a placeholder until Porsche makes the car I want. The more it drops, the more expensive that next car will be for me.

I’ve been driving Porsches since 1998 (this Taycan is my ninth) and the repair costs and depr are substantially higher.

That said I don’t want to ruin anyone else’s good time. I’ll try and quit beating that drum despite how it chafes me.

The repair costs are just insane… sadly I am not sure that is just Taycan. Even ICE cars body work, and mechanical work also feels insanely expensive lately.


The double whammy of high costs and limited techs that can work it sting too.

 

[ze_shark]

Surprising comment i got from local Porsche sales (who ironically cannot seem to get me a production slot) about the slow down in Taycan production: Macan EV is priced too closely to Taycan and cannibalizes sales.

I am not sure that the slow down in mainstream BEV sales and the Tesla collapse are relevant to what happens with Taycan.

 

[DerekS]

A friend suggested to me the Taycan is following the normal depreciation of a Panamera, which I’ve never owned and I’m unfamiliar with.

 

[feye]

Is anybody surprised!

And blaming a slow down of EV sales? Most issues are internal to Porsche.

https://electrek.co/2024/07/05/porsche-slow-taycan-output-can-macan-ev-boost-sales/

Well not only Porsche!

1. The Chinese market is evaporating. Porsche cannot compete with their EVs there, they are way too slow to bring new electric models to market, and then the battery tech is old and the warrenty too little.

2. Porsche with their "Power-to-Fuels" marketing hype and all their lobbying dollars to break the EU climate goals damaged their home market in Germany.

 

[Scandinavian]

Surprising comment i got from local Porsche sales (who ironically cannot seem to get me a production slot) about the slow down in Taycan production: Macan EV is priced too closely to Taycan and cannibalizes sales.

I am not sure that the slow down in mainstream BEV sales and the Tesla collapse are relevant to what happens with Taycan.

I had a very similar conversation with my local Porsche sales guys. I seem to be the only early 2020 Taycan owner to still own a Taycan. For use in south of France, the Taycan is too large, to high consumption (early models), and too many visits to dealership. It is difficult to park in garages that are designed to cater for small French cars. The sales guys also confirmed that nearly all of the previous Taycan owners had switched to a Macan ICE in wait for the electric Macan. So perhaps we shall see a large number of Macans on the road instead.
I believe the EV market in France has actually gone against the trend in EU and increased demand in first half of 2024. But all with smaller models.

 

[Scandinavian]

Well not only Porsche!

1. The Chinese market is evaporating. Porsche cannot compete with their EVs there, they are way too slow to bring new electric models to market, and then the battery tech is old and the warrenty too little.

2. Porsche with their "Power-to-Fuels" marketing hype and all their lobbying dollars to break the EU climate goals damaged their home market in Germany.

Yes the Chinese market is very challenging for the German producers now. Guess it will get even more difficult with the EU’s implementing the new import taxes.

And I have seen in Norway that some Chinese brands on a very reasonable priced SUV type car has given battery warranty of 10 years and 1 million km’s!

 

[chun]

Ofc sales of brand NEW EVs have slumped. Ofc Taycan sales have slumped. Ofc legacy brands sell like shit in china

Most people aren't blind, they buy used at 30-50% the price of new. 50-100km of extra range is not enaugh to make people to buy at 3x the price a refreshed version.

Most people are losing their jobs and have no job security in 2024. People aren't going to buy 250.000 cars. People want cheap EVs (and the macan is not cheap EV).

If you go on youtube, most people praise chinese cars to hell and back. Take the xiamoi car for example, this is the feedback from customers: taycan performace at 1/20 of the price, taycan luxry at 1/20 of the price, infotaiment system with chatgpt in it that can control everything in the car, house, phone or any gadget, better range, better batteries.

These legacy brands need to appeal to the general buyer in china, not the 90year olds retired milionares that bought their first house at 21 after 3 months of "hard work"; if they want to sell EVs

 

[Redhot2474]

Just for the record. Sales for Porsche increased in 2023 by 3% to 309,884 worldwide. “The Taycan also posted double-digit gains, with 40,629 customers taking delivery of their new car (+17 per cent).”

There were 50,146 sales of the 911, and 87,355 Macan sales. Largest seller was the new Cayenne at 87,553.

Would have been interesting to know what % were upgrading existing Taycan, I’d still imagine the pool of 1st time buyers is low

 

[Murph7355]

It's what Porsche needed to do. Question is, can lower demand meet production units targets.

EVs generally are still very expensive, though cars generally seem to have accelerated onwards. Without subsidies, they're a difficult proposition for most. Compounded by higher interest rates over the last few years.

I think all manufacturers need to think carefully about expected volumes. As 6 figure prices become the norm, the market diminishes. And even at the lower end, charging 20%-50% more for the EV isn't helping affordability.

Will be interesting to see what happens. I don't see Porsche selling hundreds of thousands of EV Macans at their prices either. But away from Porsche... 100k for an EV XC90? 75k+ for an EV SUV Kia? 30k for an EV compact Peugeot? They're not going to be selling in huge volumes either.

 

[tigerbalm]

It is worth remembering that soon after launch of the original Taycan they had to 2x factory production because demand was double Porsche's highest estimated sales volume.

There was obviously a pent-up demand from early adopters who wanted a sports car like experience from a traditional manufacturer.

Perhaps some of this fall off in sales is just the end of the incredible launch figures that the Taycan got?

 

[chun]

It is worth remembering that soon after launch of the original Taycan they had to 2x factory production because demand was double Porsche's highest estimated sales volume.

There was obviously a pent-up demand from early adopters who wanted a sports car like experience from a traditional manufacturer.

Perhaps some of this fall off in sales is just the end of the incredible launch figures that the Taycan got?

That is definitely a logical conclusion.

But investors won't like logic. Investors like "big number go up". And porsche, like any other public company lives and dies by what the investors think of it.

 

[tigerbalm]

That is definitely a logical conclusion.

But investors won't like logic. Investors like "big number go up". And porsche, like any other public company lives and dies by what the investors think of it.

Porsche stock is the second worst performing stock in my current portfolio. Though I only bough some as a novelty/fan owner than a serious investment.

My worst performing shareholding is in FastNed (a Dutch-based EV charging company) – down 50% since I purchased. I have a much more significant position there – and am in it for the long haul. Though the company performance is much worse than the customer experience they deliver!

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